Warning shot, or not...

[SovereignAxe]

One thing I wanted to add to my last statement was that your weapon out of your holster should serve the same purpose as a warning shot. If the BG isn't standing down after you draw your weapon, he needs to be put down and bullets need to be going into him and nothing else.

 

[thebigsd]

One thing I wanted to add to my last statement was that your weapon out of your holster should serve the same purpose as a warning shot. If the BG isn't standing down after you draw your weapon, he needs to be put down and bullets need to be going into him and nothing else.

Yes, absolutely. This is a great way of putting it. If the sight of your gun in the holster is not enough warning, drawing certainly should be.

 

[BROKENSPROKET]

Brokensprocket, anyone can talk a good game, but you'd have likely learned something on Saturday. However, your attitude would not have been welcome.

I like range time to pratice to be prepared for what may never happen, not salivate over shooting bad guys.

 

[Shotgun]

LOL, I don't "fancy" myself to be anything. I know what I am, and I only teach and employ techniques that are likely to increase one's chances of survival, not decrease-- such as what you advocate.

I have a long list of nationally recognized firearms instructors. Would you care to inform each of them that they're wrong in teaching the proper hold when approaching danger? Because it's all based on the assumption that the gun is already in one's hand.

 

[HandyHamlet]

Never assume. It makes an @ss out of you and me.

 

[MKEgal]

No warning shot, ever.
If I were OCing & someone attacked, he's made his decision.
No hesitation to shoot if I felt endangered.
(I'd still try to back away & tell him "NO!", or "STOP!")

cc, however, I might hesitate slightly to let the BG realize he's just made a very bad error, & possibly decide to either run away or fall down & wait for cops to come rescue him from "dat crazy b|+ch wit da gun" before I have to make him fall down.

The pistol would be in hand, pointed at his chest, while he made his choice.
If he kept coming at me, he'd fall down.
And I might not hesitate. If it's happening at close range, there's no time to give him a second chance.
If he weren't attacking me, he wouldn't get hurt.

Most states will consider a "warning shot" a negligent or dangerous discharge and charge you for it regardless of the damage done/justification.
...If you're in fear for your life shoot center of mass until they stop, you stand the best chance of survival and the lowest chance of prosecution.

+1 on both

There could be circumstances when having your gun in your hand is a good idea while you're assessing the situation.

At home, waiting & hoping the BG doesn't come up the stairs.
Facing down a group, while there's still distance/time.
But at SD distances? No time.

if there was time I would make sure a VERY LOUD warning shouted vocally (borderline scream) would be cause for pause for the BG.

Also attract attention, so people might see what's happening.
"STOP! DON'T HURT ME! STAY AWAY!"

I guess I should have pointed out that, while you could quickly surmise the safety of the background to your target (the baddie)

Part of the reason citizens have a better hit rate than LEO is because our encounters happen @ closer range.
If he's at arm's length (to start), it's hard to miss.

 

[McX]

an odd question that came to mind; if your in a bar do you get a warning shot?

 

[MKEgal]

I like range time to pratice to be prepared for what may never happen, not salivate over shooting bad guys.

We did that, too, after we made the range zombie-free.
At close range, draw & fire (one shot, for placement; other times 2 + 1 drills for more realistic response).
Then draw, fire, & move away while continuing to throw lead at them.
And some other things.
I never saw anyone salivating about that, though the zombies were drooling & leaking a bit.
And there were some lustful comments about Joe's arsenal.

 

[BROKENSPROKET]

We did that, too, after we made the range zombie-free.
At close range, draw & fire (one shot, for placement; other times 2 + 1 drills for more realistic response).
Then draw, fire, & move away while continuing to throw lead at them.
And some other things.
I never saw anyone salivating about that, though the zombies were drooling & leaking a bit.
And there were some lustful comments about Joe's arsenal.

After post # 37, based on what I wrote, Grant said that I would not have been welcome. That gives me the impression that he is just salivating over getting to shoot and kill a BG someday. I don't ever want to take a life, but if i have to, I will and sleep at night.

 

[MKEgal]

I saw that.
Just telling you that we did do what you say you'd want to do at a range, & then some.

That gives me the impression that he is just salivating over getting to shoot and kill a BG someday.

Oh, man... you're far far off target there. (The new phrase I learned is "Maggie's Drawers".)
I don't doubt that he would defend himself, but being eager, looking forward to it?
No.

 

[protias]

an odd question that came to mind; if your in a bar do you get a warning shot?

Good point. If the criminal isn't willing to give you a warning shot, there is no way I'd afford him the same courtesy

We did that, too, after we made the range zombie-free.
At close range, draw & fire (one shot, for placement; other times 2 + 1 drills for more realistic response).
Then draw, fire, & move away while continuing to throw lead at them.
And some other things.
I never saw anyone salivating about that, though the zombies were drooling & leaking a bit.
And there were some lustful comments about Joe's arsenal.

I really enjoyed the 2v1 and 3v1 drill. At the end of the day, it was chest (perp 1), eye (perp 2), both lungs (perp 3).

I really enjoy all my firearms, but I just don't have the time or the place (well, now I do , so mostly time) to shoot everything. I know someone was really eying up the 1911 and PS90, so I had to keep close watch on them.

 

[smithman]

People who fire warning shots can end up in more trouble than those who shoot someone. If your life was in imminent danger, why did you fire a warning shot into your neighbor's garage instead of center mass of the perp? And if you shoot someone in the hand, I am sure that will draw some questions. Your only hope is to say (if its true of course) that you're a horrible shot and you were aiming for the center of mass and your fudged the trigger pull and anticipated the recoil.

 

[scm54449]

It's the law of physics. What goes up must come down. That "warning shot" will come down at almost nearly the velocity it was shot.

A statement from someone who never studied physics or who sat in a physics class with his head in placed in an orifice where God did not intend the human head to go. Probably still believes that a penny tossed from the Empire State Building can flatten a taxi pulling up to the front entrance...*facepalm*

 

[oak1971]

This is why only serious practitioners of Gunkata should be allowed to own firearms. A level 10 Gunkata does not even need a firearm by the way. A level 10 can dispense rounds simply by throwing them. A level 10 Gunkata does not concern themselves with what is behind the target. Because the level 10 Gunkata IS behind the target. All rounds let out by Gunkatas land in a relatively safe place. The target's body. Higher level Gunkatas understand the gravity in any situation. Although the laws of gravity do not apply as Gunkatas can fly using their minds.

Gunkata. It's not just a myth.

I'll have two of whatever he's drinking. :lol:

 

[Jesse]

My definition of a warning shot is as follows:

Short burst from M2 splits bag guy in half, warning everyone else in area not to do what bad guy did.

 

[Badger Johnson]

Ya gotta love these guys who say with bravado (or whatever):

"...and I'd sleep at night".

What utter horse hockey...making, in my mind, everything they say just 'blah-blah-blah'.

FWIW.

 

[JamesB]

I'll have two of whatever he's drinking. :lol:

What's the recipe for a 'warning shot'? I wonder if my local bartender knows?

 

[JamesB]

To answer the original question:

I teach my students; Never shoot to warn. Never shoot to wound. Never shoot to kill. Always shoot to live.

The second worst thing that could ever happen to me is to find myself standing over the body of some dumbass who forced me to put him down. If such a thing occurs, I already expect to be arrested, charged and hauled off. I expect to have to sell everything I own to pay for my defense. I expect to have the entire experience haunt me for a very long time.

The worst thing that can happen is me laying at the feet of some dumbass that decided I should stop breating for the forseeable future.

If I keep those two priorities straight, the rest just floats by.

 

[TaurusToter]

Have you seen the price of defensive ammo lately? I'm thinking a verbal warning is enough. :banana:

As far as sleeping that night, I'm thinking that wouldn't be possible since you'll more than likely be sleeping in a jail cell for the first couple nights. Even a self defense shooting will land you in jail because the police are trained to arrest everyone and let the lawyers hash it out. :banghead:

 

[Outdoorsman1]

I am mentally prepared, able, and willing to to whatever nessesary to protect myself and mine, but even in a self-defence justified shoot, I am thinking it would be a very, very long time before I would be able to get a good nights sleep.... The action of taking a life, even in self defence is not something that I would be able to just put out of my mind in order to sleep....

Just sayin

Outdoorsman1