WalkingWolf
Regular Member
+1 The abuse by 'SWAT' teams needs to be dialed wayyyyy back, if it takes disbanding them to make the public safe, then the sooner the better.
Last edited:
-
We are now running on a new, and hopefully much-improved, server. In addition we are also on new forum software. Any move entails a lot of technical details and I suspect we will encounter a few issues as the new server goes live. Please be patient with us. It will be worth it! :) Please help by posting all issues here.
-
If you are having trouble seeing the forum then you may need to clear your browser's DNS cache. Click here for instructions on how to do that
-
Please review the Forum Rules frequently as we are constantly trying to improve the forum for our members and visitors.
King county cop charged with prostituting wife and selling/obtaining guns illegally?
- Thread starter Freedom1Man
- Start date
+1 The abuse by 'SWAT' teams needs to be dialed wayyyyy back, if it takes disbanding them to make the public safe, then the sooner the better.
EMNofSeattle
Regular Member
you sound just like an anti gunner "we need to make the public safe" uhh.... what is the statistics showing they are unsafe?
Dave_pro2a
Regular Member
EMNofSeattle
Regular Member
great, that's not a statistic. it's a map of everything Radley Balko claims is unjustified since 1985.
out of how many raids, agencies, officers, etc hoe many raids were wrong address, someone killed unjustifiably, etc etc etc. there is no statistics on the page you cited. only a raw number. if I made the same map involving non police officers killing people with guns since 1985 those map markers would just 30 thick everywhere on the map....
OC for ME
Regular Member
As usual your misplaced faith in the state and their jack-booted goons blinds you to the point being made. One is too many. In almost every case the cops deny any wrongdoing as is the case with sheriff Nitwit.
WalkingWolf
Regular Member
Don't worry, elimination of SWAT should not affect the sales of SWAT video games. At least not right away...
PistolPackingMomma
Regular Member
PistolPackingMomma
Regular Member
Dead bodies, destroyed families and trampled liberties only matter when the body count reaches a magic number. They just haven't told us what it is yet...
Maverick9
Regular Member
So even though crime has gone down in some categories the raids have gone up 100x? Why isn't the US gang/thug-free?
What if we completely stopped having SWAT raids? What if we used SWAT only for the gravest extreme situations? There would be 5,000 civilians still alive and maybe 1,000 incidents (1/40th) not quickly covered. IOW, normal police would gear up, we'd use negotiation, isolation, sheer numbers.
IMO, virtually all No-Knock Raids are unnecessary. What's the freakin' rush? Wait for the guy to go out for milk and cigs, fercryinoutloud.
I say this as a person who is a LAC, only one moving violation in the last 35 years, and one of my dear friends from the old days is a chief of police in one of the largest counties in our state.
Last edited:
EMNofSeattle
Regular Member
and yet for people like you, policies you support lead to loads of people dying, lack of healthcare, because any subsidy is evil, people die from drugs, from the violence drugs create, broken families, mass shootings because we cant have any socialist mental health care, and that number will never be too high for you. at least I have a cut-off when I'm willing to say it's a problem and not ignore it....
i'll throw you a number, more then 1 wrong address raid per year per 50,000 population of the agencies AOR then we'll look at problems.
you also don't have a liberty to sell drugs, or run criminal enterprises, so that's not really a trampled liberty issue. sorry, can't imagine ben franklin selling methamphetamine out of a burned out house in detroit.....
Last edited:
Dave_pro2a
Regular Member
Put down the crack pipe, please.
EMNofSeattle
Regular Member
maybe crime has gone down because we've begun to employ more aggresive enforcement and prosecution of drug and criminal enterprise laws, which is the type of things no knock raids are often used for. the "war on drugs is a failure" meme has always entertained me, anyone who believes that clearly wasn't living in a large city in the 1980s.....
the total number of yearly homicides is abotu 8500, there is no way police raids are responsible for 5000, that would be over 60%.
in the 1970s only a few large cities had SWAT teams, and crack was yet to hit the streets.
Maverick9
Regular Member
I don't get what you're saying. With the sophistication we now have of surveillance, identification, and communication there should at least be a significant drop every year of these botched paramilitary style raids.
Let's look at just the mid-Atlantic region (VA/DC/MD). From 1985 to 2014 there have been about 30+ botched ops. It looks like a steady 3-4 per year. That seems like a lot of 'mistakes' to me.
Are you saying because her atrocity is worse, this one is acceptable?
If you asked a SWAT team member, 'Sir, how many botched ops, killed innocents, wrong address per year is acceptable in your area'. I would hope he'd say 'NONE/NADA/ZERO' and they would be making it their PRIORITY to stop these. Instead they're making it a priority to go on raids.
EMNofSeattle
Regular Member
3-4 per year, and how many agencies run these raids? what's a botched op? how many people live in the area. that's what, 600,000 in DC, 4,000,000 in VA? maybe 2,500,000 in MD? I agree it's a problem, but is it a systemic problem caused by incompetence, malice, etc or is it a problem of, when in a large enough area, with enough people, and enough activity something is bound to happen? That's what I want to know,
I don't know any officers who want to just go raiding like the Vikings for the hell of it.
in my area a "SWAT raid" is 4 or 5 officers meeting the gear van, shining the spotlight in the window and announcing to the occupants there is a search warrant please come out of the house over a vehicle PA system.
once people are in custody the detectives take over the search adn the "SWAT" guys leave...
I view this like I view school shootings, it's terrible when one happens, but it's not part of a wider trend, and certainly not wide enough were gun laws can have any effect.....
PPM is a complete libertarian and believes government taxation is literal theft and that the state is no better then mafioso...
Last edited:
sudden valley gunner
Regular Member
Hahahaha this is so full of crap! Redherring straw and adhominemm OH MY! I'll have fun with these posts even though most of it is fallacy scratch.
l
Mass shootings are way down too, another fact conveniently ignored by statist. Even if what you said is true the answer doesn't lie within the state, people need to be responsible for their own safety. Assuming someone ignores the problem because they don't jump to the same asinine solutions you do is ignorant.
Really, babies burning, houses being destroyed, innocents being killed but that's ok with you?
You mean Mr. Franklin who warned about sacrificing safety for liberty? Why don't people have that liberty oh wait because its being trampled. Do you even read what you write?
No truth illogical and a lie. More people die by the state and their supporters than any other single issue. Loving human nature and trusting people has never caused anyone to die.
l
, Lack of knowledge of history or what has caused the biggest damage to healthcare, yet even if its true stealing from people don't justify "healthcare".
Any state subsidies are evil, they are theft involuntary and distort human society growth and evolution
Yes people die from drugs, they also die from many other things too including a lot more from cigarrettes and alcohol. Drugs create no violence, what a dumb thing to say, Divorce rates peaked in the 70's, yet your are ignoring the vital fact that after the expansion of the welfare state the lack of families had dramatically increased.
Mass shootings are way down too, another fact conveniently ignored by statist. Even if what you said is true the answer doesn't lie within the state, people need to be responsible for their own safety. Assuming someone ignores the problem because they don't jump to the same asinine solutions you do is ignorant.
Really, babies burning, houses being destroyed, innocents being killed but that's ok with you?
You mean Mr. Franklin who warned about sacrificing safety for liberty? Why don't people have that liberty oh wait because its being trampled. Do you even read what you write?
sudden valley gunner
Regular Member
Why don't they serve the notice in daylight by a regular officer with no militarized equipment?
Maybe because that wouldn't be "better than sex"?
sudden valley gunner
Regular Member
Get rid of SWAT. Period. Highly unconstitutional to have a militarized standing army against its own people.
Firearms Iinstuctor
Regular Member
Numbers, numbers every where who believes the numbers.
Or are we ruled by emotion.
Facts and figures who's right who's wrong.
Some people can do math, some can not, others know they are right just because.
I hope you have fun with this.
It has been a long day
Or are we ruled by emotion.
Facts and figures who's right who's wrong.
Some people can do math, some can not, others know they are right just because.
I hope you have fun with this.
It has been a long day
PistolPackingMomma
Regular Member
:eyeroll:
Try again, sugar. I haven't been libertarian in a long while.
Also, if you don't know of anyone wanting to go on swat raids for the hell of it, acquaint yourself with the officers in FL.
http://reason.com/archives/2010/12/13/the-swat-team-would-like-to-se
Thank god they arrested those folks cutting hair without a license, zomg! Chaos and anarchy abounds!!! If we didn't send in the SWAT teams, someone might have walked out with a mullet!
