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Do Americans actually think..

KYGlockster

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Dec 9, 2010
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Location
Ashland, KY
Canadians can own firearms, rifles and handguns. They can even open carry rifles & shotguns (to and from home/the range). You do need to take a small short class to be able to own a handgun though, and after that you can keep as many guns as you want, in a safe (unloaded) with the ammunition in another locked area around your house.

You can defend yourself no problem, as long as the gun wasnt loaded before the incident. A man in Quebec shot 2 cops in self defense when they illegally executed a no-knock warrant on his home at 3am, with his 2 kids and wife in the house. He shot the one cop in the head, and the heart, with a 357 at point blank range, and was found innocent of murder charges.

The gun laws here are not THAT bad, and people can even own, and buy machine guns (If they owned one before the 80's and the machine guns were made before then)

Occasionally, you may get a conceal carry permit, if you can prove your life is in danger, they will give you a temporary one until you have reason enough to believe you're safe.

All in all, the gun laws are not horrible, and years ago you could carry anything and own anything no problem, it's just recently that Canada passed some stupid laws about guns, but recently many people have been working hard to get these laws gone, so Canadians can start carrying and keeping loaded guns in the house.

Plus, with a HUGE amount of our country mostly Forrest and other things, there is a very high amount of hunters here, and many people own rifles, handguns, crossbows, etc.

People often think we have no guns, because, Canada actually has an extremely low rate of guns used in crimes. (Except Toronto, which is like the Canadian Detroit)
these are what I would consider horrible gun laws. First they make you get training before even owning a handgun? Insane, Everyone has a GOD given right to defend themselves any waY THEy deem necessary. You can only Carry your rifle/shotgun to and from a range to home, that is horrible. Your handgun has to be kept unloaded and ammo stored in a different place, both of them locked? Tell me how this guy u mentioned unlocked his gun, and loaded it and shot cops who was doing a no knock warrant. Obviously that gun was already loaded, because on a no knock warrant they are on you in no time, first thing they do is detain all occupants of the home. You also state you can even BUY machine guns, but then you say they had to be made and BOUGHT before the 80's, so how can you buy a machinegun now if it has to be bought before the 80's to be lawful?? These are total deprivation of human rights. It doesnt due a whole lot of good to own a gun, if you cant even carry it, and keep it loaded in your own home if it is for self defense. If your laws are this erronious, Id say it wont be long before owning a handgun in canada is a thing of the past. And you seem content with these laws? If I must live in canada, I would be doing everything I could to have these laws removed, I wouldnt even be able to sleep at night just thinking about how badly people where running my life. Here in good ol Kentucky, I can go right now to the gun store, buy as many guns I want, load everyone of them, set em right on my dash, and drive home. I think the good lord he blessed me with living in such a wonderful country and an even better state. Fight for your rights, stand up for yourself, and do not settle for them stripping you of your ability to protect yourself.
 

MikeTheGreek

Regular Member
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Mar 29, 2011
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Location
Northville, Michigan
You also state you can even BUY machine guns, but then you say they had to be made and BOUGHT before the 80's, so how can you buy a machinegun now if it has to be bought before the 80's to be lawful??
If you bought a machine gun before the 80s, you have a license to buy/sell/trade machine guns that were bought before the 80's, with the people who bought them.

So there is a small group of Canadians, who have owned machine guns for a long time, that buy/trade/sell their guns between each other.

Once they all die (& They're usually in their 50's+ now) nobody will ever be able to buy/sell/trade a machine gun in Canada(Other than LE or MIlitary), unless they change the laws.

Fight for your rights, stand up for yourself, and do not settle for them stripping you of your ability to protect yourself.
Not many people in Canada actually feel the need to own firearms to protect themselves. They're more laid back, most Canadians go their entire lives without using a firearm. I was fine with the laws, until I moved to Michigan.

Decided, working on 8mile, and since I want to be LE. Carrying a gun for protection and getting used to carrying one, would be good experience.
 
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Daylen

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Aug 29, 2010
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America
Not many people in Canada actually feel the need to own firearms to protect themselves. They're more laid back, most Canadians go their entire lives without using a firearm. I was fine with the laws, until I moved to Michigan.
Sounds like Kaliforniskia just before the riots. Trouble is once arms are needed its too late to get them. I take it Canadians are not much of individualists.
 

MikeTheGreek

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Location
Northville, Michigan
Sounds like Kaliforniskia just before the riots. Trouble is once arms are needed its too late to get them. I take it Canadians are not much of individualists.
A lot of Canadians are from other countries, countries that they had to flee from because of wars. Not many Canadians are worried about having to protect themselves, or the SHTF scenarios that a lot of Americans talk about.

Canadians are more relaxed, & Canada tries to stay out of wars and stuff, so they don't get the reputation that the USA has lol.

We tend to just sit back and not worry about stuff, & it's worked so far.
 

Aknazer

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Mar 6, 2011
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California
At a crime rate of 7,518 per 100,000 (2006 numbers) in Canada compared to 3808 in the US for the same year. So while Canada might have a lower murder rate, they have nearly double the crime rate. That's not something I would be relaxed about if I was a Canadian.

These numbers were pulled from Wikipedia and by googling US crime rate if you're curious.
 

DevinWKuska

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Feb 5, 2011
Messages
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Spanaway
Ahh, that would allow one to more quickly respond, but still requires them to keep their safe in their room and still prevents them from being able to defend theirself when not at home (or should someone break in when they aren't close to the safe). And to me that would still be pretty bad as it still greatly restricts one's ability to defend theirself.



You can't get a carry permit to carry on base. Even security forces and OSI can't carry while on base unless they are on duty and the gun was issued to them from the armory (at which point they have to turn in the gun once their shift ends).

As for storage, it depends on your service. I've heard of Army/Marine barracks having their own mini-armory at the actual barracks for weapons (dunno if all of them have this though), while in the AF (and I would assume the Navy as well) you have to use the base armory. Firearms are not allowed to be stored in the barracks or at the base hotel (I had the cops called on me for that one when I simply asked the hotel manager their policy, but that's another story...). If you live in actual base housing then you can store the weapons at your house, but there's requirements for doing so. In addition, any weapon stored on base (whether at the armory or in on-base housing) requires paperwork. I can't speak for other services (though I assume it's very similar if not the same), but in the AF the paperwork has various info about the weapons and must be signed by your commander specially stating where the weapons are being stored.

For your final question. Each base and service is different in regards to when one can move out of the dorms. You would need to get to your base and ask the question to your leadership, but in the AF you generally have to be at least a Senior Airman (E-4) before being able to move off base when single (or married, but don't get married to move off base as people do get kicked out for doing that). Oh and once you get to the point to be able to move out of the dorms know that if you decide you want to try and live in base housing there's generally a waiting list (but again this is base dependent and the length of the list varies from each base).
Hmm I think the policies must very from base to Base. I work on Joint base Lewis McChord(use to be Ft Lewis, and McChord AFB) and it is clearly posted "No personal firearms allowed on these premises. All registered firearms must be pre-approved by XXX(I forget the term but it was like armory quartermaster or some such). The barracks do have armories but they are for the units firearms not personal. No personal firearms allowed in housing either. Basically if you live on base your almost defenseless. I suspect the no personal firearms in base housing is due to the higher then normal domestic homicides on Ft. Lewis in the past 10 years.
 

DevinWKuska

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Feb 5, 2011
Messages
300
Location
Spanaway
True, every day that I read about Michigan's gun laws or the laws of other states, I realize how retarded a lot of the Canadian laws are. Apparently there is actually a law in Canada saying that if somebody comes into your home, armed or unarmed, you're legally supposed to attempt to retreat. I don't think anybody has been arrested for not complying with that yet, but then again we don't have many self defense shootings here.
Well I think canada needs to take a field trip to say... NYC or Detroit... maybe we can get this gun law thing turned around a bit eh?

Regarding machine guns... U cannot own one in Washington state atleast not without being a FFL(even then I think it has to be made unable to function while its stored, could be wrong though) But some of those other gun laws are kind of odd. I wonder what was the reasoning for Canada to enact a law forcing you to store ammunition and firearms separate, or have said lock(either way gun and ammo apart at home)?
 

DevinWKuska

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Spanaway
Sure, here ya go. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Basil_Parasiris

It has the information there, you can also google his name and find multiple articles.

There has never been a Canadian convicted of Improper Storage Of A Firearm, with regards to self defense shootings, if they were ruled that use of deadly force was justified.
HOLY S***!!! This guy is surgical with a .357. During the wee hours of the morning he awoke to armed men rushing into his room. He flies out of bed grabs his gun and his first two shots? One to the head, and the second to the heart! 4 shots in a dazed and weary state and this guy places his first two shots in kill zones and manages to hit another assailant atleast once... wow!
 
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MikeTheGreek

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Mar 29, 2011
Messages
590
Location
Northville, Michigan
HOLY S***!!! This guy is surgical with a .357. During the wee hours of the morning he awoke to armed men rushing into his room. He flies out of bed grabs his gun and his first two shots? One to the head, and the second to the heart! 4 shots in a dazed and weary state and this guy places his first two shots in kill zones and manages to hit another assailant atleast once... wow!
Well, the police did execute an illegal no-knock warrant while him, his wife, and kids were inside.

They didn't identify themselves either.

By the time they got to his bedroom door, he was waiting with his .357, shot the first 2guys to come through the door.

Dudes a beast...lol
 

Aknazer

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Mar 6, 2011
Messages
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Location
California
Hmm I think the policies must very from base to Base. I work on Joint base Lewis McChord(use to be Ft Lewis, and McChord AFB) and it is clearly posted "No personal firearms allowed on these premises. All registered firearms must be pre-approved by XXX(I forget the term but it was like armory quartermaster or some such). The barracks do have armories but they are for the units firearms not personal. No personal firearms allowed in housing either. Basically if you live on base your almost defenseless. I suspect the no personal firearms in base housing is due to the higher then normal domestic homicides on Ft. Lewis in the past 10 years.
if someone were to pcs to the base the base armory would have to store the weapons until the member got the paperwork signed by his commander. Should someone be denied the ability to store their weapons on base while residing on base I would bet they could get it ruled as an unlawful order as it is unduly restricting your freedoms and the person issuing the order doesn't have the authority to do so (though it would likely be a long fight similar to the recent fight about commanders who required off base people to register their guns on base. Congress stepped in and said that was unlawful for commanders to do). Yes there are gun buster signs at the gates, but they can't stop residents of the base from bringing their lawfully owned weapons onto it.

When I pcsed to my current base I had the cops called on me by a moron when I was asking questions about the gun policy (she told the cops I had a gun illegally on base). It's DOD policy that governs it all and even a lot of cops don't fully know it, so I wouldn't be surprised if your base had an improper policy in effect, but from what the cops told me the base has to allow or supply storage of firearms for those that live on the base (including those that are in the base hotel due to a pcs, though these don't require the paperwork to be signed by the commander, only permanently stored weapons require the commander's signature).
 

DevinWKuska

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if someone were to pcs to the base the base armory would have to store the weapons until the member got the paperwork signed by his commander. Should someone be denied the ability to store their weapons on base while residing on base I would bet they could get it ruled as an unlawful order as it is unduly restricting your freedoms and the person issuing the order doesn't have the authority to do so (though it would likely be a long fight similar to the recent fight about commanders who required off base people to register their guns on base. Congress stepped in and said that was unlawful for commanders to do). Yes there are gun buster signs at the gates, but they can't stop residents of the base from bringing their lawfully owned weapons onto it.

When I pcsed to my current base I had the cops called on me by a moron when I was asking questions about the gun policy (she told the cops I had a gun illegally on base). It's DOD policy that governs it all and even a lot of cops don't fully know it, so I wouldn't be surprised if your base had an improper policy in effect, but from what the cops told me the base has to allow or supply storage of firearms for those that live on the base (including those that are in the base hotel due to a pcs, though these don't require the paperwork to be signed by the commander, only permanently stored weapons require the commander's signature).
Your points make sense. So perphaps they do have some plaze that can store personal weapons. But I am certain(legal or not) that people in the barracks cant keep weapons, and housing is no personal weapons either. But the housing is a sticky situation anyways. Its technically owned/ran by Equity Housing. So I suspect they have some round about way of saying its private property/management so no guns. Thus I am finding those with guns either store them at say their 1st sgts house off base or keep them somewhere unkown to me. (Just imagine going to a 1st sgt friend and his office has 30 handguns and a dozen long guns that arnet his lol)
 

Aknazer

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Your points make sense. So perphaps they do have some plaze that can store personal weapons. But I am certain(legal or not) that people in the barracks cant keep weapons, and housing is no personal weapons either. But the housing is a sticky situation anyways. Its technically owned/ran by Equity Housing. So I suspect they have some round about way of saying its private property/management so no guns. Thus I am finding those with guns either store them at say their 1st sgts house off base or keep them somewhere unkown to me. (Just imagine going to a 1st sgt friend and his office has 30 handguns and a dozen long guns that arnet his lol)
That would be pretty humorous to see that many guns in his office. Though I am curious as to how the housing isn't allowed to have any weapons. I know that when I was a kid my parents stored their weapons on Little Rock AFB and when I asked them the rule was that it was supposed to be unloaded and locked (so gun safe, pelican case, trigger lock, etc). Now I'm stationed at Tinker AFB and when talking with the cops that showed up for the illegal weapon call they stated that Tinker has the same rules that my parents had when I was growing up in regards to storing the weapons in base housing (oh and Tinker base housing has been turned over to a contractor company, so it would be like what you're talking about just with a different name of the contractor).

If you live on the base and care enough you could start asking around to try and figure out what rules/regs that govern the storing of civilian weapons on base (would need to make sure to get any supplements/policy letters specific to the base). You would be best off starting at the armory, and make sure to say that you would like to see the reg that governs it and any base policy letter. Don't just take their word (that was partially what led to having the cops called on me). Once you have the info on why the guns can't be stored in base housing (likely a policy letter) you could take it to either JAG or the ADC and see about talking with them about if it's a lawful policy or not, or if the base isn't properly following the reg. Or potentially take it to your congressman about how you as a LAC are having your rights unduly infringed upon simply because you live in base housing.

Of course that's a lot of work simply for a question on a board, so unless it directly affects you or someone you supervise I likely wouldn't bother.
 

sudden valley gunner

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What surprises me is how many Canadians think there are not very many guns in their country. I run into many who acknowledge that the crooks don't abide by the laws that restrain Canadians and they seem to get them. But than I have talked into so many that feel that Canadian gun laws have worked and the crooks don't have them because of it. And then they blame U.S. for the ones the crooks do have.
 

NewZealandAmerican

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Greater Salt Lake City Metro area far south suburb
canadian cops, off duty

Haha. The only way I'd ever move back to Canada is to be a cop after the army. Cops in Detroit make between 20 and 30 starting (Something I was told by a Detroit cop a few years back)

but, directly across the Detroit bridge, in Windsor, Ontario, starting cops make about 47k starting.

Considering the fact, 2 years ago, a police officer was shot in Windsor, & he was the first cop to be killed in 95 years there. I think it's a bit more safe for cops..lol
Is it true that regular patrol cops in Canada can't carry off duty? That they have to turn in their sidearm at the end of their shift?
 

MikeTheGreek

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Is it true that regular patrol cops in Canada can't carry off duty? That they have to turn in their sidearm at the end of their shift?
Carrying a firearm in Canada (Unless you're an ON duty police officer) is illegal, doesn't matter who it is. Off duty cops can not carry firearms, even in the most dangerous areas of Canada. Which is something I think they should definitely change.
 

NewZealandAmerican

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Nov 30, 2007
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348
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Greater Salt Lake City Metro area far south suburb
Carrying a firearm in Canada (Unless you're an ON duty police officer) is illegal, doesn't matter who it is. Off duty cops can not carry firearms, even in the most dangerous areas of Canada. Which is something I think they should definitely change.
Do they still get to take their sidearm home or do they have to turn it in and the end of the shift?
 

bom1911

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Sep 2, 2009
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Chesterfield County , USA
Carrying a firearm in Canada (Unless you're an ON duty police officer) is illegal, doesn't matter who it is. Off duty cops can not carry firearms, even in the most dangerous areas of Canada. Which is something I think they should definitely change.
I don't. If the regular people aren't allowed to carry to defend themselves, the police shouldn't be allowed to either.
 

carry for myself

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May 1, 2011
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Maine
this is where the saying "canadians cant even bring their guns to the mall" comes from. and an exact point of why no matter how hard big brother tries to take our gun rights from us........i will NEVER MOVE TO CANADA. i like bringing my gun EVERYWHERE :-D .....the store, the park, the mall, get gas, go see a movie, out to dinner, to the gunshop, to the petstore, to the florist, get a haircut, tanning, the beach, the pool, snowboarding, skydiving............few others too! :-D
 

Daylen

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this is where the saying "canadians cant even bring their guns to the mall" comes from. and an exact point of why no matter how hard big brother tries to take our gun rights from us........i will NEVER MOVE TO CANADA. i like bringing my gun EVERYWHERE :-D .....the store, the park, the mall, get gas, go see a movie, out to dinner, to the gunshop, to the petstore, to the florist, get a haircut, tanning, the beach, the pool, snowboarding, skydiving............few others too! :-D
I hope you leave it on the beach and don't go swimming in salt water with it :eek:
If so that poor gun. When I bring mine to the gun shop mine gets anxious about maybe having another friend come home with it... or is that just me :)
 
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