imported post
Mike wrote:
hugh jarmis wrote:
I've tried to keep quiet on this discussion because having tried to plan a few oc cookouts, I know its like herding cats. But a few thoughts:
-isn't resorting to having the picnic on private property defeating the purpose?
Late to discussion here -why are picnic organizers retreating to private property??
Read pages 5-7ish. Upon reviewing the Preemption statuue, we discovered that its application to local law regarding parks may not be as clear-cut as we previously thought. While before we were under the impression that it preempted it completely, on further reading it was shown that the local law may be valid as it could be perceived as "similar" to a state law in principle...And therein lies the problem: The whole thing depends on how a judge percieves the law. I'm not about to be the ringleader who gathers a group to be test cases for a court, I'd rather be the ringleader of a bonafide legal activity, and that's why I moved it to private property.
hugh jarmis wrote:
I've tried to keep quiet on this discussion because having tried to plan a few oc cookouts, I know its like herding cats. But a few thoughts:
-isn't resorting to having the picnic on private property defeating the purpose?
If the purpose of an OC cookout is postivePR and press coverage to show other people that OC is perfectly legal. If the event is suppose to promote Open Carry... What message are we sending to the public when television cameras show up to show a bunch of people who didn't even have the courage or ability to 'practice what they preach' and OC out in public?
And this is no knock on anyone. BELIEVE ME, I've been gung-ho, reserved a picnic area, paid the res. fee, and had to cancel. I know exactly how frustrating it is.
But we now have the AG clarifying the law. We now have people freely OC'ing ALL over the place, and the next thing we are going to do is retreat to private property tucked away in a residential area for an OC event?
I'd much rather participate in an open carry walk on Memorial Day than retreat to private property for a cookout.
I'd rather see 100 people OC taking an orderly stroll down the lakefront along lincoln memorial drive on the sidewalk rather than hiding in someones backyard.
And if thats too close to "veterans park" than I'd rather we map out a route along Wisconsin ave that avoids schools and take a nice leisurely OC walk around downtown Milwaukee. We'll have EVERY news station in Milwaukee there I GUARANTEE.
We can fight these VERY ambiguous issues of "parks" later. So if we can't find a public place to have an OC cookout, then a "cookout" isn't going to advance our cause. (unless someone finds a municipality that doesn't have a firearms prohibition in their parks)
But to be honest, its a lot less planning, and a lot more public and a LOT better statement to make (considering the comments of Milwaukee's police chief) to do an open carry stroll down Wisconsin Ave or down Water Street past city hall. No porta potties required. No food required. MORE publicity.
No, I don't feel that an OC Picnic in my yard defeats the purpose, and here's why:
Look at the public's reaction to the Krause case. Here was a man who showed that having a firearm at your side while engaging in a lawful activity is, despite what the crazies opposing us think, absolutely normal.
This picnic will be a carry-over of the same principle: A gathering of friends enjoying some food in a residential backyard, that have the "audacity" to have firearms on their person, demonstrating that you can live a normal life while openly armed.
I don't think the location matters as much as the media attention, the latter of which I'm sure we'd be getting for putting this on.
Watch the Virginia OC Picnic video that I linked to in the first post in this thread. Mike can correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't see a crowd of bystanders/protestors surrounding the covered structure they had the picnic in, nor did the camera crew go around to passersby and ask their opinion of "those gun nuts over there." From what I saw, it was just a picnic in a somewhat isloated park of the park that had no pedestrians nearby, and all of the attention recieved to the picnic by those who did not attend was through the media report.
Now, how is a picnic in a residential yard different from that, save the location?
A march follows the same principle as a picnic, except more forceful. It's a demonstration, forcing people to see what we're doing, as opposed to having a private function showing how our activity is normal.
Don't get me wrong, I'm all for a march (and one of the reasons I created my mapping tool was to plan for one), but I still believe the picnic is a great idea, especially for those who do not want to participate in a march and get tackled by Flynn, yet still want to meet those with like interests, and who fight for the same cause.
). But it if it would make more space for actual members I would be more than happy to just bring one. Whatever works for you, it is your property, and I am as appreciative as they next person for you letting us use it. But definately add 2 to your list, as long as it isn't too full as of yet. Also, let me know about anything that may be needed, I'm open for any kind of contributions I can make.