You simply can't say that OC is better/easier/faster than CC... because you can always find someone faster/better.
The majority of members here are aware of that. I don't think anyone here is attempting to be a fastest draw gunfighter. We have been in awe in several threads of videos of the professional shooters and their astounding abilities.
The reason I came here, is because I just moved to kalifornia, and in Los Angeles (where I live), a CCW is nearly impossible. So OC is my ONLY option for protecting myself.
That is the situation for several of our members.
Because of this, I inquired the intelligence of those on LF.net. Those guys are the reason why the rest of us buy guns, gear, shirts with guns on them, hats with american flags on them, multicam uniforms and ammo pouches, etc. these guys have been there, they've used their firearms to protect themselves, they've fought (and some of them died) for the things we love and endulge ourselves in every day.
There are many ex-military on OCDO and with few exceptions, the membership is very much aware of, respectful of and thankful for our active and former military and their profound service to and sacrifice for this nation. This thread is about a difference of opinion on one aspect of gun ownership and carry. Such a disagreement does not in any way denigrate the knowledge or wisdom of anyone on any forum who has had to use firearms for defense of person or our nation.
I'm not at all saying anything you guys are doing - or anything you guys stand for is wrong. All I'm saying is that you have to understand that even if you think what you're doing is politically correct/legal/"the right thing to do", it isn't the best thing.
As I have said, I don't think that either CC or OC is the best in every single situation and neither do the military guys because they sure as heck aren't CCing in the sandbox. Also, LF isn't made up of every single current or ex military member of the United States so their opinion is not necessarily universal or even majority, although it may be. I know ex-military with CCWs who nearly always OC anyway and others who mirror what I understand from the few threads I have seen as LF's consensus. We have members who are currently there doing that now. Not everyone, regardless of shared backgrounds, reaches the same conclusions from those experiences. It doesn't necessarily make anyone right or wrong. And this is not a cross-forum feud or anything. This thread was discussing a single matter in a single thread on LF. There are multiple matters in multiple threads on OCDO with which I am in the minority opinion. Most of us find ourselves in that position on any forum from time to time. We may disagree today and agree tomorrow. Again, that doesn't make anything right or wrong or best or worst across the board.
like I said a half hour ago, I was initially trained on CC, and think that is the best way for me. The "element of surprise" is more than that...its about knowing you CAN do something but knowing you DON"T HAVE TO do something at the same time. Because seriously, do you REALLY think you can take down a "bad guy" when the time comes? How do you know you won't just clam up, roll up into a ball in the corner when bullets start flying? why? because you have taken a class on shooting? because you have invested $3000 in your 1911? because you have the latest greatest gear that "BLACKHAWK" inc. has to offer?
There have been numerous comments and discussion on OCDO about the possibliity of not reacting the way you hope you would in a real life situation. Few, if any, people here are unaware of that possible reality. This is not a forum of mall ninjas. Most of us are professionals and students living regular suburban lives who believe that sometimes we have to assert our rights to maintain our rights. Also, OC does NOT require that you HAVE to do something in a given situation. I understand the argument that because your firearm is visible you are more likely to be drawn into the situation by the BG, but given the reality of self-defense situations, the speed with which they occur and the tunnel vision of the perps and victims, and lack of evidence to the contrary, I doubt this is typically a reality in America. It very well may be a reality in Falluja, but I don't live near there and do not presume to even begin to hypothesize my behavior if I did.
The reason I am here, is because when I get denied my CCW permit from los angeles county, I will result in OCing to PROTECT MY LIFE!
The reality for many of our members.
isn't that the goal here? BUT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
That doesn't mean that I will be completely one-sided and think that because I OC that I am untouchable.
There is where your apparent impressions get sideways with the purpose of the members here and IMO, the majority view. We don't think we are "untouchable" because we OC. I do not feel any more protected OC rather than CC unless I have to CC in a more inaccessible manner than I would prefer for some reason. And in a crowd, I typically CC. Some people who OC may think that their OC will deter all BGs and allow them to live a safe life, but that is a rare opinion on OCDO. Also, you miss the fact that more than 2/3 of us also have our CC license/permit and CC when appropriate, required or more convenient. OCDO does not have a prevalent position that CC is bad, but rather that OC is good.
But my point is, be open to different opinions,
Most of our membership is unless those opinions are couched in absolutes.
especially those who have been through the experiences that you all dream of.
Here is where you totally leave the tracks. There may be some here who dream of going into armed combat and there are definitely some who have, but I don't think that most of us who have not dream of it. Most of us hope to never have to use our firearms to harm another human being. We are willing to otherwise we wouldn't carry, and we respect those who have done so in the defense of our nation, but we are not dreaming of or longing to rush into combat. To argue that we do echos the arguments of certain antis and LEOs who accuse all citizens who carry of being "wannabe Wyatt Earps" or "wannabe LEOs". I, like I think the majority of other OCDO members, just wanna go home to my family every night, protect them from danger, and protect my business during business hours.
I truly hope you enjoy your time on OCDO and take the time to approach the forum with an open mind. There is a lot of knowledge here as well, although much of it is different than you find on other forums, but then, if it weren't, there would be no purpose for this forum.