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NC OC experience reports

NC-Heel

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 31, 2012
Messages
326
Location
Charlotte, NC
Have never seen such a sign on the inside of any of the Waffle Houses in Virginia, nor have I seen a sign like that in any Waffle House anywhere.

waffle12.jpg

gQEIUG5.jpg

aefcc025-c665-e14d.jpg


Waffle House' corporate policy is no firearms.
http://forum.opencarry.org/forums/s...ouse-Nationwide-No-Carry-Policy-Now-In-Effect
http://alabamaopencarry.com/forum/index.php?topic=3492.0
http://gunsnfreedom.com/waffle-house-customer-ignores-company-policy-on-guns-and-stops-criminal/
 
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Grapeshot

Legendary Warrior
Joined
May 21, 2006
Messages
35,331
Location
Valhalla
I am perfectly aware of Waffle House corporate policy and their exterior signs. My reference was to the allegation of interior signs.
 

NC-Heel

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 31, 2012
Messages
326
Location
Charlotte, NC
I am perfectly aware of Waffle House corporate policy and their exterior signs. My reference was to the allegation of interior signs.
Two of those alleged signs are INTERIOR signs. Maybe they put them in NC & SC stores but not Va ones.
 
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carolina guy

Regular Member
Joined
Jun 21, 2012
Messages
1,741
Location
Concord, NC
I think it does. I'll have to look it up, but the preemption on firearms laws allows municipalities to pass ordinances against display of firearms on municipality owned property.


Finally got back around to this...and looked up the ordinance at municode...I think they might lose this one in court as it is overly broad and has essentially been struck down in district court, and also by the NC Supreme court in the past:

http://library.municode.com/showDocumentFrame.aspx?clientID=19967&jobId=&docID=0

Sec. 46-23. Display of firearms or other dangerous weapons at public place or public assembly prohibited.
hyperlink.png
(a)
It shall be unlawful for any person to display a firearm or other dangerous weapon, as defined by section 46-22 in any public place or at any public assembly.
(b)
For purposes of this section, the following words have the meanings indicated:
Public assembly means any gathering where the public has been invited, without payment of an admission fee or charge, for the purpose of viewing or participating in some function or event, including but not limited to, concerts, fairs, expositions and health screenings, and the public parking areas thereof.
Public place means privately owned property or part thereof which is commonly made available for the use and enjoyment of the general public, including but not limited to, religious facilities, hospitals, medical clinics, restaurants, service stations and garages, shopping malls and shopping centers, stores, office buildings and theatres, and the public parking areas thereof.
(c)
This section does not apply to:
(1)
Law enforcement officers of any agency of federal, state or local government while in the discharge of their official duties.
(2)
Personnel of the United States armed forces or of the national guard while in the discharge of their official duties.
(3)
The owner or lessee of the public place or the area in which the public assembly occurs.
(4)
A registered security guard hired by the owner or lessee of the public place or by the person or organization sponsoring the public assembly.
(5)
A person participating in a public event held at the public place with the written permission of the owner or lessee of the public place, or as part of the public assembly with the permission of the person or organization sponsoring the public assembly.
(6)
A person who has purchased a firearm or other dangerous weapon from the owner or lessee of a public place, or who is returning or seeking the repair or servicing of thefirearm or dangerous weapon by the owner or lessee of the public place, during the time necessary to deliver the firearm or dangerous weapon to the owner or lessee or to remove the firearm or dangerous weapon from the public place.
(7)
A person enrolled in a bona fide hunter training or gun safety course during the time the person is participating in the course and during the time necessary to go to or return from such activity.
(Code 1982, § 12-23; Ord. No. 10067, § 1, 2-7-1994)
 

Grapeshot

Legendary Warrior
Joined
May 21, 2006
Messages
35,331
Location
Valhalla
NC Premption Statute

§ 14-409.40. Statewide uniformity of local regulation.

(a) It is declared by the General Assembly that the regulation of firearms is properly an issue of general, statewide concern, and that the entire field of regulation of firearms is preempted from regulation by local governments except as provided by this section.

(a1) The General Assembly further declares that the lawful design, marketing, manufacture, distribution, sale, or transfer of firearms or ammunition to the public is not an unreasonably dangerous activity and does not constitute a nuisance per se and furthermore, that it is the unlawful use of firearms and ammunition, rather than their lawful design, marketing, manufacture, distribution, sale, or transfer that is the proximate cause of injuries arising from their unlawful use. This subsection applies only to causes of action brought under subsection (g) of this section.

(b) Unless otherwise permitted by statute, no county or municipality, by ordinance, resolution, or other enactment, shall regulate in any manner the possession, ownership, storage, transfer, sale, purchase, licensing, or registration of firearms, firearms ammunition, components of firearms, dealers in firearms, or dealers in handgun components or parts.

(c) Notwithstanding subsection (b) of this section, a county or municipality, by zoning or other ordinance, may regulate or prohibit the sale of firearms at a location only if there is a lawful, general, similar regulation or prohibition of commercial activities at that location. Nothing in this subsection shall restrict the right of a county or municipality to adopt a general zoning plan that prohibits any commercial activity within a fixed distance of a school or other educational institution except with a special use permit issued for a commercial activity found not to pose a danger to the health, safety, or general welfare of persons attending the school or educational institution within the fixed distance.

(d) No county or municipality, by zoning or other ordinance, shall regulate in any manner firearms shows with regulations more stringent than those applying to shows of other types of items.

(e) A county or municipality may regulate the transport, carrying, or possession of firearms by employees of the local unit of government in the course of their employment with that local unit of government.

(f) Nothing contained in this section prohibits municipalities or counties from application of their authority under G.S. 153A-129, 160A-189, 14-269, 14-269.2, 14-269.3, 14-269.4, 14-277.2, 14-415.11, 14-415.23, including prohibiting the possession of firearms in public-owned buildings, on the grounds or parking areas of those buildings, or in public parks or recreation areas, except nothing in this subsection shall prohibit a person from storing a firearm within a motor vehicle while the vehicle is on these grounds or areas. Nothing contained in this section prohibits municipalities or counties from exercising powers provided by law in states of emergency declared under Article 1A of Chapter 166A of the General Statutes.

(g) The authority to bring suit and the right to recover against any firearms or ammunition marketer, manufacturer, distributor, dealer, seller, or trade association by or on behalf of any governmental unit, created by or pursuant to an act of the General Assembly or the Constitution, or any department, agency, or authority thereof, for damages, abatement, injunctive relief, or any other remedy resulting from or relating to the lawful design, marketing, manufacture, distribution, sale, or transfer of firearms or ammunition to the public is reserved exclusively to the State. Any action brought by the State pursuant to this section shall be brought by the Attorney General on behalf of the State. This section shall not prohibit a political subdivision or local governmental unit from bringing an action against a firearms or ammunition marketer, manufacturer, distributor, dealer, seller, or trade association for breach of contract or warranty for defect of materials or workmanship as to firearms or ammunition purchased by the political subdivision or local governmental unit. (1995 (Reg. Sess., 1996), c. 727, s. 1; 2002-77, s. 1; 2012-12, s. 2(z).)

http://www.ncga.state.nc.us/EnactedLegislation/Statutes/HTML/BySection/Chapter_14/GS_14-409.40.html
 
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carolina guy

Regular Member
Joined
Jun 21, 2012
Messages
1,741
Location
Concord, NC
I think the only sections that give Durham the appearance of the ability to regulate OC is:

http://www.ncleg.net/EnactedLegislation/Statutes/HTML/ByChapter/Chapter_160A.html
§ 160A-189. Firearms.
A city may by ordinance regulate, restrict, or prohibit the discharge of firearms at any time or place within the city except when used in defense of person or property or pursuant to lawful directions of law-enforcement officers, and may regulate the display of firearms on the streets, sidewalks, alleys, or other public property. Nothing in this section shall be construed to limit a city's authority to take action under Article 1A of Chapter 166A of the General Statutes. (1971, c. 698, s. 1; 2012-12, s. 2(zz).)

http://www.ncleg.net/EnactedLegislation/Statutes/HTML/ByChapter/Chapter_153A.html
§ 153A-129. Firearms.
A county may by ordinance regulate, restrict, or prohibit the discharge of firearms at any time or place except when used to take birds or animals pursuant to Chapter 113, Subchapter IV, when used in defense of person or property, or when used pursuant to lawful directions of law-enforcement officers. A county may also regulate the display of firearms on the public roads, sidewalks, alleys, or other public property. This section does not limit a county's authority to take action under Article 1A of Chapter 166A of the General Statutes. (1973, c. 822, s. 1; 2006-264, s. 16; 2012-12, s. 2(yy).)

I am pretty sure that "regulate" does not include a blanket prohibition.


§ 14-409.40. Statewide uniformity of local regulation.

(a) It is declared by the General Assembly that the regulation of firearms is properly an issue of general, statewide concern, and that the entire field of regulation of firearms is preempted from regulation by local governments except as provided by this section.

...snip...

(f) Nothing contained in this section prohibits municipalities or counties from application of their authority under G.S. 153A-129, 160A-189, 14-269, 14-269.2, 14-269.3, 14-269.4, 14-277.2, 14-415.11, 14-415.23, including prohibiting the possession of firearms in public-owned buildings, on the grounds or parking areas of those buildings, or in public parks or recreation areas, except nothing in this subsection shall prohibit a person from storing a firearm within a motor vehicle while the vehicle is on these grounds or areas. Nothing contained in this section prohibits municipalities or counties from exercising powers provided by law in states of emergency declared under Article 1A of Chapter 166A of the General Statutes.
...snip...

http://www.ncga.state.nc.us/EnactedLegislation/Statutes/HTML/BySection/Chapter_14/GS_14-409.40.html
 

WalkingWolf

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 31, 2011
Messages
11,912
Location
North Carolina
Display is laid out in State V Kerner as only relegated to the size of a handgun carried. Some local government has tried to take privilege with the wording to ignore the court ruling. Cary had a similar ordinance that was completely ignored.

http://www.guncite.com/court/state/107se222.html

"The Constitution of this state, section 24, art. 1, which is entitled, "Declaration of Rights," provides, "The right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed," adding, "nothing herein contained shall justify the practice of carrying concealed weapons or prevent the Legislature from enacting penal statutes against said practice." This exception indicates the extent to which the right of the people to bear arms can be restricted; that is, the Legislature can prohibit the carrying of concealed weapons but no further."

"It is also but a reasonable regulation, and one which has been adopted in some of the states, to require that a pistol shall not be under a certain length, which if reasonable will prevent the use of pistols of small size which are not borne as arms but which are easily and ordinarily carried concealed. "
 
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Grapeshot

Legendary Warrior
Joined
May 21, 2006
Messages
35,331
Location
Valhalla
Chapel Hill - restrictions on size:

(9) Small, readily concealed handguns, as opposed to larger firearms, are more likely to be carried on the public streets and sidewalks and because they are often carried in an unlawful, concealed manner they pose an increased danger to public safety and welfare, and are otherwise more likely to be used in conjunction with criminal activity.

(10) Handguns which are less than six (6) inches in overall length are easily and ordinarily carried concealed.

There is more......

http://library.municode.com/index.a...tomBanner=19952.jpg&imageclass=L&cl=19952.txt
 

carolina guy

Regular Member
Joined
Jun 21, 2012
Messages
1,741
Location
Concord, NC
Thanks WW and Grape! I think that Durham's police "know" the ordinance is not legal as written and are doing the right thing for now. Ignore it.
 

WalkingWolf

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 31, 2011
Messages
11,912
Location
North Carolina
Also take note that nowhere in the state laws or local ordinances is display explained or a definition given, which by default leaves that to the common definition of display. Which is clearly NOT open carry, even though not concealed holstered open carry only shows a portion of the handgun, and is not carried for any of the purposes below. Though some CC only folks have tried to make that claim. Open carry of a firearm while out and about is covered by two distinct rights that are bound together, the right to self defense, and the right to travel. Not even taking into account the second amendment, and the state constitution. Removing the firearm from the holster to show or threaten IMO would be display. If the local governments could outlaw open carry they would not bother with using the word display, also indicating that display and open carry are separate. INAL just my humble opinion.

dis·play [dih-spley] Show IPA
verb (used with object)
1.
to show or exhibit; make visible: to display a sign.
2.
to reveal; betray: to display fear.
3.
to unfold; open out; spread out: to display a sail.
4.
to show ostentatiously; flaunt.
5.
Printing. to give special prominence to (words, captions, etc.) by choice, size, and arrangement of type.

Funny since the display of a firearm is illegal, and not the carrying of a firearm, those wearing shirts with gun emblems would be illegal... :lol:
 
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SovereignAxe

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 29, 2011
Messages
795
Location
Elizabethton, TN
Yesterday I went to Hendersonville to pick up my friend in the Air Force that just got back from Okinawa. He needed a ride to Charlotte to pick up his car which was being tuned and dyno'd at Pro Dyno-which seemed like a pretty good shop.

I had a good experience with the cashier at Chik-Fil-A in Hendersonville. She asked my why I carry a gun and I told her it was for personal protection. She then asked if had a conceal carry permit, to which I replied that I'm from Tennessee, so I have a handgun carry permit-which covers both in my state, but don't need for NC. She seemed more curious than scared or anti, so I considered it an educational encounter.

Unfortunately I wasn't told that this dyno shop was in the South Carolina side of Charlotte-Fort Mill, SC to be more specific. I expected it to be in NC, so I was dressed for OC only (OWB holster, and a polo that fits perfectly), and it was a wee bit too warm in SC to throw on the jacket I had in the car. So I ended up having to throw my Walther in the glove box for our the duration of our stay at the tune shop.

Later we went to a place I'd never heard of-Tilted Kilt. If you like Hooters you'll like that place. Only it makes Hooters look considerably G rated in comparison. This is after crossing back over the border in to NC. Unfortunately they sell alcohol for consumption, and from what I understand of the repealing of that restriction in NC's law, it only applies to conceal carriers. So I kept it in the car for that stop as well. I then reholstered as soon as I got back to the car after we finished.

But before the trip back to Hendersonville we had to make a stop for fuel for my friend's thirsty Thunderbird. I still had plenty of fuel left in my Subaru to get there, so I went in the store to relieve my bladder full of three refills of water while he filled up with premium for his built, and aggressively cammed, naturally aspirated 4.6L 2V Mustang GT engine (he got 318 hp/317 lb-ft on the dyno if anyone is curious.). It wasn't until I got inside the bathroom that I realized that the funny thing about Charlotte is that you can cross back and forth across the NC/SC border without realizing it, and I had no idea what state I was in. So I whipped out my trusty Blackberry, went to the maps app, and centered it on my location. Sure enough I was about a quarter mile south of the border. GRR ARG. So I did one of the most embarrassing things I've done in recent memory. I unholstered my PPQ and VERY carefully stuffed it in my cargo pocket-where it just barely fits, btw! and then quickly walked out of the building and back to my car.

It's amazing how much a headache moving back and forth between two state's borders can be. Just let it be a lesson, kids: pay attention to which side of a border you're on if the laws are drastically different!
 
Last edited:

carolina guy

Regular Member
Joined
Jun 21, 2012
Messages
1,741
Location
Concord, NC
Also take note that nowhere in the state laws or local ordinances is display explained or a definition given, which by default leaves that to the common definition of display. Which is clearly NOT open carry, even though not concealed holstered open carry only shows a portion of the handgun, and is not carried for any of the purposes below. Though some CC only folks have tried to make that claim. Open carry of a firearm while out and about is covered by two distinct rights that are bound together, the right to self defense, and the right to travel. Not even taking into account the second amendment, and the state constitution. Removing the firearm from the holster to show or threaten IMO would be display. If the local governments could outlaw open carry they would not bother with using the word display, also indicating that display and open carry are separate. INAL just my humble opinion.

dis·play [dih-spley] Show IPA
verb (used with object)
1.
to show or exhibit; make visible: to display a sign.
2.
to reveal; betray: to display fear.
3.
to unfold; open out; spread out: to display a sail.
4.
to show ostentatiously; flaunt.
5.
Printing. to give special prominence to (words, captions, etc.) by choice, size, and arrangement of type.

Funny since the display of a firearm is illegal, and not the carrying of a firearm, those wearing shirts with gun emblems would be illegal... :lol:


I think you are about 100% on the mark here...
 

bc.cruiser

Regular Member
Joined
Apr 2, 2011
Messages
782
Location
Fayetteville NC
I replied that I'm from Tennessee, so I have a handgun carry permit-which covers both in my state, but don't need for NC.

Later we went to a place I'd never heard of-Tilted Kilt. If you like Hooters you'll like that place. Only it makes Hooters look considerably G rated in comparison. This is after crossing back over the border in to NC. Unfortunately they sell alcohol for consumption, and from what I understand of the repealing of that restriction in NC's law, it only applies to conceal carriers. So I kept it in the car for that stop as well. I then reholstered as soon as I got back to the car after we finished.


It's amazing how much a headache moving back and forth between two state's borders can be. Just let it be a lesson, kids: pay attention to which side of a border you're on if the laws are drastically different!

Your TN permission slip is recognized here as a valid CHP. Unless you were unable to CC, you would have been okay to carry in TK (assuming unposted) as long as you did not consume alcohol. You mentioned that your gun barely fit in your cargo pocket--that would have been sufficient, even if not utilitarian. (NOTE: The law only actually states that you must have a CHP, not that you must CC. But I'm not going to be "that guy") Next time come prepared to CC; you'll be ready for SC also that way.:D
 

Jamesm760

Regular Member
Joined
Apr 13, 2013
Messages
429
Location
Salisbury, NC
Yesterday I went to Hendersonville to pick up my friend in the Air Force that just got back from Okinawa. He needed a ride to Charlotte to pick up his car which was being tuned and dyno'd at Pro Dyno-which seemed like a pretty good shop.

I had a good experience with the cashier at Chik-Fil-A in Hendersonville. She asked my why I carry a gun and I told her it was for personal protection. She then asked if had a conceal carry permit, to which I replied that I'm from Tennessee, so I have a handgun carry permit-which covers both in my state, but don't need for NC. She seemed more curious than scared or anti, so I considered it an educational encounter.

Unfortunately I wasn't told that this dyno shop was in the South Carolina side of Charlotte-Fort Mill, SC to be more specific. I expected it to be in NC, so I was dressed for OC only (OWB holster, and a polo that fits perfectly), and it was a wee bit too warm in SC to throw on the jacket I had in the car. So I ended up having to throw my Walther in the glove box for our the duration of our stay at the tune shop.

Later we went to a place I'd never heard of-Tilted Kilt. If you like Hooters you'll like that place. Only it makes Hooters look considerably G rated in comparison. This is after crossing back over the border in to NC. Unfortunately they sell alcohol for consumption, and from what I understand of the repealing of that restriction in NC's law, it only applies to conceal carriers. So I kept it in the car for that stop as well. I then reholstered as soon as I got back to the car after we finished.

But before the trip back to Hendersonville we had to make a stop for fuel for my friend's thirsty Thunderbird. I still had plenty of fuel left in my Subaru to get there, so I went in the store to relieve my bladder full of three refills of water while he filled up with premium for his built, and aggressively cammed, naturally aspirated 4.6L 2V Mustang GT engine (he got 318 hp/317 lb-ft on the dyno if anyone is curious.). It wasn't until I got inside the bathroom that I realized that the funny thing about Charlotte is that you can cross back and forth across the NC/SC border without realizing it, and I had no idea what state I was in. So I whipped out my trusty Blackberry, went to the maps app, and centered it on my location. Sure enough I was about a quarter mile south of the border. GRR ARG. So I did one of the most embarrassing things I've done in recent memory. I unholstered my PPQ and VERY carefully stuffed it in my cargo pocket-where it just barely fits, btw! and then quickly walked out of the building and back to my car.

It's amazing how much a headache moving back and forth between two state's borders can be. Just let it be a lesson, kids: pay attention to which side of a border you're on if the laws are drastically different!

Tilted Kilt... Must check that out sometime. Thanks for sharing.
 

SovereignAxe

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 29, 2011
Messages
795
Location
Elizabethton, TN
Your TN permission slip is recognized here as a valid CHP. Unless you were unable to CC, you would have been okay to carry in TK (assuming unposted) as long as you did not consume alcohol. You mentioned that your gun barely fit in your cargo pocket--that would have been sufficient, even if not utilitarian. (NOTE: The law only actually states that you must have a CHP, not that you must CC. But I'm not going to be "that guy") Next time come prepared to CC; you'll be ready for SC also that way.:D

Ah, thanks for the correction. I'd only heard about it from a friend. So I guess it's a good thing I erred on the side of caution. But still, I didn't discover the pocket thing until afterwards at the gas station. Also, it's not a very effective place to draw from-nor is it very safe considering the trigger wasn't covered up. And then there's the awkward feeling of having a 1.5 pound gun hanging down around my knee.

Tilted Kilt... Must check that out sometime. Thanks for sharing.

No problem. Think catholic schoolgirl outfits with pushup bras. The place markets itself as an Irish pub, but the only thing Irish about it is the decor and the shepherd's pie that's on the menu. And two of the waitresses had red hair. That being said, I wasn't complaining too much. It's not like Hooters has the best food in the world either. But nobody goes for the food ;)
 

Jamesm760

Regular Member
Joined
Apr 13, 2013
Messages
429
Location
Salisbury, NC
No problem. Think catholic schoolgirl outfits with pushup bras. The place markets itself as an Irish pub, but the only thing Irish about it is the decor and the shepherd's pie that's on the menu. And two of the waitresses had red hair. That being said, I wasn't complaining too much. It's not like Hooters has the best food in the world either. But nobody goes for the food ;)

Sir I dont need a description. Their website has a photo section with the "Kilt Girls", I pulled it up while I was at work (probably not a smart idea) and some co-workers also agreed that it is a place we indeed need to check out sometime.
 

325rto

Regular Member
Joined
Nov 2, 2013
Messages
93
Location
Fayetteville, NC
Ah, thanks for the correction. I'd only heard about it from a friend. So I guess it's a good thing I erred on the side of caution. But still, I didn't discover the pocket thing until afterwards at the gas station. Also, it's not a very effective place to draw from-nor is it very safe considering the trigger wasn't covered up. And then there's the awkward feeling of having a 1.5 pound gun hanging down around my knee.



No problem. Think catholic schoolgirl outfits with pushup bras. The place markets itself as an Irish pub, but the only thing Irish about it is the decor and the shepherd's pie that's on the menu. And two of the waitresses had red hair. That being said, I wasn't complaining too much. It's not like Hooters has the best food in the world either. But nobody goes for the food ;)

That chain was featured on an episode of Undercover Boss.
 

REDFIVE48

Regular Member
Joined
May 17, 2010
Messages
253
Location
Charlotte, NC
Your TN permission slip is recognized here as a valid CHP. Unless you were unable to CC, you would have been okay to carry in TK (assuming unposted) as long as you did not consume alcohol. You mentioned that your gun barely fit in your cargo pocket--that would have been sufficient, even if not utilitarian. (NOTE: The law only actually states that you must have a CHP, not that you must CC. But I'm not going to be "that guy") Next time come prepared to CC; you'll be ready for SC also that way.:D

I do it all the time now that it's legal, nothing bad happens and nobody has said a word. Maybe it's because of where I live and am carrying (Denver mainly), or maybe it's because I look like a cop, our maybe nobody cares.

Sent from my Slider SL101 using Tapatalk HD
 
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