Your thoughts on the Washington Arms Collectors

[massivedesign]

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http://dor.wa.gov/content/getaformorpublication/publicationbysubject/taxtopics/firearmtransfers.aspx

http://apps.leg.wa.gov/rcw/default.aspx?cite=82.12.040 (section 1)

(1) Every person who maintains in this state a place of business or a stock of goods, or engages in business activities within this state, shall obtain from the department a certificate of registration, and shall, at the time of making sales of tangible personal property, digital goods, digital codes, digital automated services, extended warranties, or sales of any service defined as a retail sale in RCW 82.04.050 (2) (a) or (g), (3)(a), or (6)(b), or making transfers of either possession or title, or both, of tangible personal property for use in this state, collect from the purchasers or transferees the tax imposed under this chapter. The tax to be collected under this section must be in an amount equal to the purchase price multiplied by the rate in effect for the retail sales tax under RCW 82.08.020. For the purposes of this chapter, the phrase "maintains in this state a place of business" shall include the solicitation of sales and/or taking of orders by sales agents or traveling representatives. For the purposes of this chapter, "engages in business activity within this state" includes every activity which is sufficient under the Constitution of the United States for this state to require collection of tax under this chapter. The department must in rules specify activities which constitute engaging in business activity within this state, and must keep the rules current with future court interpretations of the Constitution of the United States.

 

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massivedesign wrote:

http://dor.wa.gov/content/getaformorpublication/publicationbysubject/taxtopics/firearmtransfers.aspx

http://apps.leg.wa.gov/rcw/default.aspx?cite=82.12.040 (section 1)

(1) Every person who maintains in this state a place of business or a stock of goods, or engages in business activities within this state, shall obtain from the department a certificate of registration, and shall, at the time of making sales of tangible personal property, digital goods, digital codes, digital automated services, extended warranties, or sales of any service defined as a retail sale in RCW 82.04.050 (2) (a) or (g), (3)(a), or (6)(b), or making transfers of either possession or title, or both, of tangible personal property for use in this state, collect from the purchasers or transferees the tax imposed under this chapter. The tax to be collected under this section must be in an amount equal to the purchase price multiplied by the rate in effect for the retail sales tax under RCW 82.08.020. For the purposes of this chapter, the phrase "maintains in this state a place of business" shall include the solicitation of sales and/or taking of orders by sales agents or traveling representatives. For the purposes of this chapter, "engages in business activity within this state" includes every activity which is sufficient under the Constitution of the United States for this state to require collection of tax under this chapter. The department must in rules specify activities which constitute engaging in business activity within this state, and must keep the rules current with future court interpretations of the Constitution of the United States.

I wonder where one can find a list of these rules

It seems to me that if they are taxing purchases from out of state it may be a violation of article 1 section 10 clause 2 of the federal constitution http://topics.law.cornell.edu/constitution/articlei#section10

No state shall, without the consent of the Congress, lay any imposts or duties on imports or exports, except what may be absolutely necessary for executing it's inspection laws: and the net produce of all duties and imposts, laid by any state on imports or exports, shall be for the use of the treasury of the United States; and all such laws shall be subject to the revision and control of the Congress.

 

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:cuss:This is one of the things that upsets me about laws.
When looking at tittle 82. under chapter .12 "use tax" I see section .020 "use tax imposed". I would expect that anything and everything subject to the tax under chapter .12 ("use tax")would be enumerated in that section (.020 "use tax imposed") and the remaining sections would explain how to pay the tax, various exemptions and deductions etc. but NO we scroll all the way down to section .040 and find another list of people/activities subject to the tax!!! WTF!
:banghead::banghead::banghead:
Why not just list everything subject to the tax under the section labeled "use tax imposed" I guess that would make to much sense.

 

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I wonder if the "tangible personal property" mentioned in .040 ("retailers to collect tax") is limited to the type described in .020 ("use tax imposed")
If thats the case then it would only apply if it was to be used by "a person engaged in any business taxable under RCW 82.04.280 (2) or (7)"
and that would make sense because I thought that anything taxable under the chapter would have to be listed in the section "use tax imposed"

but then why is the DOR sending letters to gun stores telling them to start collecting the tax?

My brain hurts



I Hereby declare this RCW chapter "void for vagueness" no "use tax" for anyone!!!!:celebrate


EDIT: yeah I know 3 posts in a row sorry guys.

 

[atkpilot]

You are wrong

killchain wrote: I agree with your objections, but I also came to the conclusion that this is the only real option for me. I decided to join and check out the next few shows, we'll see how it goes and it I renew.

Members can carry into the show. Only members can sell to other members not to the general public. This insures background checks are performed avoiding the so called gun show loop hole. I think ALL shows should run like this to show the public we are responsible in who buys guns from who. The WAC is a well run club and I love going to the show to look and socialize.

 

[Metalhead47]

Aaaaaaack! Zombie thread! Zombie thread! Quick, kill it kill it before it bites another post!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[fire suppressor]

What's the point of going to a gun show if you have to leave your gun in your car

 

[Dave_pro2a]

Members can carry into the show. Only members can sell to other members not to the general public. This insures background checks are performed avoiding the so called gun show loop hole. I think ALL shows should run like this to show the public we are responsible in who buys guns from who. The WAC is a well run club and I love going to the show to look and socialize.

You're a genius.

If gun owners voluntary adopt everything that the Brady Bunch wants, then there's no loopholes and no controversy. And BONUS, it shows that we are responsible!

So no private party transfers without background check -- at gun shows or in your own driveway. (like CA!)

No deadly 'high capacity' magazines. (like CA!)

We really need that 1994 AWB back (like CA!), letting it sunset just created a big 'loophole' for deadly semi-automatic rifles with way too many evil features. Oh NoZe: EBRs!

Can we ban hollow points, aka self defense ammunition, while we're at it (like NJ!). It just makes YOU seem responsible.

And this whole 'must issue' CCW stuff is crap, way to dangerous. Can we make it discretionary issue per CLEO approval (like CA!)

Et cetera.

I like your "just give in, and just give up" philosophy.

Do you incorporate that into all areas of your life? How does that work out for you?

Admit it, you're a California transplant, right?

COMMENTS REMOVED BY ADMINISTRATOR: Attacking other gun rights group

 

[Dave_pro2a]

Members can carry into the show.

Correction: no one may carry a loaded firearm inside the event, member or not. Rule #1 http://www.washingtonarmscollectors.org/shows.htm

Of course, it's unenforceable so lots of people break that rule.

Anyone may "carry" an unloaded firearm -- member or not.

 

[Dave_pro2a]

Sorry Jim, I have to revive this thread....

This weekend Poosharker was at the Puyallup show. Poosharker is 18 yrs old and according to the RCW (9.41.060) since he IS a member of WAC he is allowed to carry a firearm to and from the event.

Exceptions to RCW 9.41.050
(7) Regularly enrolled members of clubs organized for the purpose of modern and antique firearm collecting, when those members are at or are going to or from their collector's gun shows and exhibits;

He arrived with his membership card, checked his weapon and got it zip-tied. At some point during the show security asked him to take his weapon back out to his vehicle. it turns out according to the rules of WAC unless you are 21 & a member you CANNOT carry a pistol during the show.

I encourage everyone who is a member of WAC to write to the Board of Directors and get the rule change so that it follows state law. I know WAC is a private organization but if we can get the rule changed, 18/19/20 year old's would still have to follow the same rules as everyone else as far as checking a weapon and having it tied. They would still be restricted from selling or buying a handgun.

Damn, that's just cold.

 

[hermannr]

I do not do business with companies that restrict my right to carry. It is their right to restrict, it is my right to elect to not support their policy by not doing business with them.

The WAC Group sounds like a group of old gun control nannies, strongly influenced by the Brady Bunch. I cannot believe they actually think they might believe in freedom. It is obvious that they neither believe in freedom, nor personal responsibility...unfortunate. If they were to live under a truly free set of state laws, with no restrictions, they would probably all need Depends...

You can believe, personally, that I am not going to patronize any of their events until they begin to understand what freedom and person responsibility actually means.

 

[slapmonkay]

I will keep my thoughts regarding the subject to myself, since I got flamed for them before... No need for me to reopen that can.

 

[Justman1020]

So military active duty gets a free membership, does that include entry into the shows??

 

[Dave_pro2a]

I will keep my thoughts regarding the subject to myself, since I got flamed for them before... No need for me to reopen that can.

The [strike]terrorists[/strike]bullies win if you do that.

I'm genuinely curious, and I promise I won't flame you

 

[tombrewster421]

So military active duty gets a free membership, does that include entry into the shows??

If you're a member you get in free.

About the restrictions: We don't actually know if these restrictions would exist if they had their own building. They do not have their own building as of yet and must abide by the rules set forth in their rental agreement with that venue. It's private property and they must respect the wishes of the owners.

 

[tombrewster421]

Correction: no one may carry a loaded firearm inside the event, member or not. Rule #1 http://www.washingtonarmscollectors.org/shows.htm

Of course, it's unenforceable so lots of people break that rule.

Anyone may "carry" an unloaded firearm -- member or not.

No! Not anyone can carry an unloaded gun into the show. Members only can bring in unloaded weapons.

I reviewed the rules and it doesn't appear to actually state this, but I know that they won't let you in with a gun if you're not a member because I was forced to put mine in my truck this last January because I failed to renew early. Maybe the rules are assuming that the person is a member?

 

[amzbrady]

What an awesome deal. you can carry a firearm that is tied so it is disabled in a firearm show, but only if you are a member. We openly carry daily to acclimate the public who are afraid of guns and say to hell with them because it is our right, and have discussion after discussion on how much Costco sucks because they are a membership club who is against firearms, then defend a club that should embrace firearms but wants them disabled becuase they dont trust the very people who make them money. Hmmmm.

 

[Difdi]

Correct, we use zip-ties to make the gun not able to function. Depends on the gun how we tie it up. Usually I like to go through the barrel for auto's and revolvers. Rifles are a whole different can of worms.

You can get some pretty long zip ties these days. While these wouldn't work for all rifles, I doubt many people will be carrying one around that's too long for a 5 foot long cable tie...

http://www.cabletiesplus.com/Produc...ble-Ties-(175-lb)-(Natural)__CP-60-175-N.aspx

 

[Justman1020]

Well since its free, i will be there sunday

is OCDO having a table? IF so i will be available to work it for a while.

 

[Justman1020]

Do active military dependents with ID get free membership to? Does anyone know??