This happened to me yesterday 5/21/10. There is a lot about this event on a similar thread in the Washington State forum. I appreciate your thoughts about how I reacted. Many have said that maybe I was too nice with the guy and his actions could constitute a threat to my safety.
Could be! I'd have ended the "discussion" much sooner. See below.
I deemed that drawing was a bad move because he was ultimately trying to just piss me off.
Excellent deeming!
...
I had a scary encounter with a man at target in Everett today. Me and a friend were going shopping, talking about permits for certain states as he was curious. We get to the shoe section and he proceeds to go about his business. As I am looking at a pair of potential hiking shoes the man in question takes one look at my side and the following dialouge ensues (to the best of my knowledge):
Man: What is that? Points to my side
...
Man: @#$% you man, I will talk to the cops
Me: fine have a nice day
(he finally leaves then calls over a store worker)
Employee: You ok, is there a problem
Me: ma'am, what is your store policy about open carry of firearms?
Employee: I don't think its allowed but I am not sure
Me: Ok, how would you like to proceed?
Employee: Lets go up to the front, I am not sure, but I will be calling the cops
Me: I will cooperate fully with you and law enforcement
Employee: Thank you, calls up a security officer
Security: Everything ok
By this time my nerves are frayed and details are sketchy, so I will give the short version: the security officer and the target employee call 911 who then surprisingly tell them that I am ok and within the law and have no problem with me carrying!! They also thanked me for staying calm and being informed about what i was doing, (thank you OCDO!!!!!!)
Quite, and that's my largest worry, that my own "fix it" mentality to attempt to over-control or contain the issue. Maintaining control of self and the situation is key, provided one with with what's given, and that includes the other human beings. Attempting to bowl them over or wrestle control from them almost invariably backfires.
The police were not dispatched and the man got away scott free, but the store was professional about their dealing with me and I told them as such and would be honored to participate in their business.
A hearty "Thank you for your help in successfully resolving this matter!" goes a long way.
Oh, I did tell them that the idiot tried to grab my gun and he was being a disturbance and a potential threat to public safety
Ooops... Did he really? I'm back-reading...
Man: Hey, what would you do if I did this (tries to grab the grip)
Crap, that's way out of line. I'd probably have Aikido'd his butt to the ground, said "Citizen's Arrest! Call 911! Call security!" over the guy's screams of agony (wrist and elbow locks are excrutiatingly painful, but the pain is fleeting, at best, once the grip is released)
This scenario is a lot like what a certain former LEO told me would get me arrested for "disturbing the peace."
First, you did everything right. You were fully within your right to remain there and continue to ask the guy to leave. I'd have given him a polite, but authoritative-sounding "come with me, please" by the third round and headed straight for the manager's office without another word, except to the manager to report, "I was minding my own business over there when this gentleman began accosting me. I asked him to stop, and to leave my table, but he has refused. Will you please call security?"
That's perhaps the best way to send the following clear messages:
1. To the other guy, that you're not taking his BS, that you're seeking the store owner's assistance, and that the other guy is probably now the one in hot water.
2. To the manager that you're simply a peacable, law-abiding citizen attempting to conduct business in their store.
3. To security (summoned by the manager) that you're not a threat, nor are embroiled in some sort of argument with the other guy.
Please keep in mind this action may result in the other guy blowing his top, at which point you'd have that issue to deal with, but how is that different than what may have happened if you'd remained at the table? Now you have the store manager as a witness, and as the manager's area is covered by store cameras, you have that evidence, too.
On the other hand, as soon as you begin walking towards the manager's office, the other guy may just walk off. The other guy might also wait until he's sure you're serious about talking to the manager before bolting. Either way, I'd still report him.
In addition, I'd have gone to the police station and reported him for an attempted gun grab. That's a huge no-no in most states. It appears the only question that was put to them at the time, however, was the legality of your OC. That's fine, so why would they come out? If they'd been made aware of the attempted gun grab by the other guy, they may have been a bit more interested.
The thought crossed my mind, although I think some folks are moved by an incessant insecurity-driven need to test or assert their authority. The whole progression of the other guy's conversation smacks of a mental issue, beginning at first with a slow poke or prod, followed by more and more, to the point where he attempts to grab (or at least touch) the OP's firearm. At any juncture, a swift rebuff could have stopped him cold, but it might also have driven him into a frenzy.
Can't really know for sure. My brother's always had a calming effect on folks like this, which is probably why one of his more successful jobs was working with patients at a psychiatric institution. Meanwhile, I just tend to tick people like that off.
I experienced a similar encounter, a long time ago, but it didn't involve a firearm.
