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Just got my carry permit illegally seized by deputy. (Video)

g21sfpistol

Banned
Joined
Apr 21, 2013
Messages
255
Location
iowa
the only paper permit you get is at the sheriff's office until you plastic card arrives. then you can disregard the paper that was given to you. the county CAN NOT make you carry anything else, this is why the state law changed and that's why they HAD to give it back to you. they were breaking the law and they know it. you don't need a lawyer, its clear in section 724. he couldn't tell it was you? lol ok, he should have started off with that, he was doing nothing more then fishing for a reason to take your permit.
 

F350

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 22, 2012
Messages
942
Location
The High Plains of Wyoming
People cannot be baited to commit crime, either they will, or they won't. If the opportunity is not present, they will eventually find the opportunity. Using baiting as an excuse for criminal behavior is downright stupid.

A fish that is not hungry will not take the bait.
While recovering from double knee replacements I watched a lot of a cop reality show called "BAIT CAR"; funny thing, I never saw a car thief get caught that didn't have a lengthy record. If the "baiter" is able to get an over reaction from a cop, you can bet it ain't the first time, thieves will steal and overly aggressive cops will abuse citizens, period!
 

Darkshadow62988

Activist Member
Joined
Oct 17, 2010
Messages
242
Location
Iowa
Some counties in Iowa provide just a paper permit. Some provide a card. I have been told that the reason is due to cost. Some of the small, more rural departments simply dont have the funding to buy the machine that makes the cards. I have offered to donate a laminating machine to my local office, and was turned down. Linn county provides cards with pictures. Scott county doesn't.
Yes, it does. Though that's beside the point. The LEO in the video of the OP was in clear violation of the law. He should be sued and disciplined to the fullest extent the law allows. The only way to prevent bad apples from spoiling the bunch is to completely discard them. Examples should be made of cops who violate the law. While the vast majority of LEOs are not the problem, silence is consent. When the police start keeping themselves in check these issues will be merely academic, but that day is a very far in the future.
 

Tucker6900

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 10, 2008
Messages
1,272
Location
Iowa, USA
Yes, it does. Though that's beside the point. The LEO in the video of the OP was in clear violation of the law. He should be sued and disciplined to the fullest extent the law allows. The only way to prevent bad apples from spoiling the bunch is to completely discard them. Examples should be made of cops who violate the law. While the vast majority of LEOs are not the problem, silence is consent. When the police start keeping themselves in check these issues will be merely academic, but that day is a very far in the future.
Sorry for the mistake. I should have said, "last I knew, they didnt". Thanks for the correction.

Exactly. They should be held to a much higher standard of punishment when they violate the law. Not get a free ride and a paid vacation.
 
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Darkshadow62988

Activist Member
Joined
Oct 17, 2010
Messages
242
Location
Iowa
Sorry for the mistake. I should have said, "last I knew, they didnt". Thanks for the correction.

Exactly. They should be held to a much higher standard of punishment when they violate the law. Not get a free ride and a paid vacation.
Punishment is the least effective form of conditioning, though it is still effective. Rewards for catching dirty cops would be far more effective at catching dirty cops and it would work more often, but will never be utilized bc it would come at the cost of inter-officer relations and they literally rely on those to do their jobs/survive. Just holding them to a respectable standard would be fine. They don't need to be punished more for doing the same things. They need to be punished because, as LEOs, they can commit different crimes than everyday citizens and those different crimes should be punished differently. This is no different a concept than how driving over the speed limit receives a different punishment(ticket) than drunk driving(more than just a ticket).

Back to the topic of this thread: when the encounter started, the LEO had RAS/PC to stop/arrest OP(carrying weapons is a crime until you present to a peace officer the permit to carry weapons). Once the OP presented his permit to the officer the RAS/PC disappeared. It doesn't matter if the officer understood that at the time. He can be disciplined/sued for it later because he should have known. The decisions by the OP to: 1. Not state that he didn't consent to a search/seizure of his person or property from the very beginning and 2. Speak to the officer other than with the minimum that was absolutely necessary made the encounter consensual. The LEO in the video extended the interaction as long as he could, it would seem, in hopes the OP would violate the law to the point he could make an arrest that would stick(though it seemed more like a **** measuring contest by the end). Had the OP just walked away, put his firearm away and immediately gone to file a formal complaint and seek out legal counsel this would have been a slam dunk civil rights violation lawsuit. It might still be one the OP could win, but it won't be as simple as it could have been.

Everybody who has time to positively contribute to this forum should have seen some version of the video, that's very famous on YouTube, of a law professor telling his students, "Don't talk to Police" that leads into a video of a LEO giving the same message. In a legal system as brutal, heartless, and militarized as we have in the US, working with the police is seldom a good idea. An exception to this would be to point out/encourage them to pick up/collect evidence they may have missed, like a missed witness or shells and/or casing from a shootout. The police are not anyone's friends. They exist to make arrests in order to imprison people and seize(steal) property. They exist because evil exists and we as a society wish to minimize/limit evil and its actions. Their supposed purpose does not make them immune from committing acts of evil themselves. If the police want to ask questions, they can make an arrest or summon someone to testify at trial. Everyone has a right to choose to remain silent without legal counsel and refuse to answer any questions unless the questions being asked could not be used in any way to incriminate them. This is the very basic stuff that even children can understand.

Whenever interacting with LEO's there are two options. Option 1: keep it as brief as is necessary, win. The good LEO's will do it by the book and be done quickly. The bad LEO's will keep tripping over themselves as they give you more and more reason to buy a new wallet to fit the money you are about to win from them. Option 2: don't keep it as brief as possible. Keep giving the LEOs and the courts reasons not to take your complaints seriously while you attempt to understand why kissing the boot that kicked you doesn't get you what you want.

The biggest enemy to the OP in all of this was the OP himself. Play stupid games(arguing with a cop on the side of the road without witnesses biased in your favor), win stupid prizes(don't get to win as much, if at all, when you sue that cop).
 
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MAC702

Campaign Veteran
Joined
Jul 31, 2011
Messages
6,337
Location
Nevada
...I never saw a car thief get caught that didn't have a lengthy record...
That's all fine and good, as long as you at least know they edit their footage and choose to air only the most sensational clips that help their agenda, if they have one.
 

papa bear

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 25, 2010
Messages
2,224
Location
mayberry, nc
Sorry for the off topic. but I just can't get my mind around this

Are you saying that the people of Iowa, must have a permission slip from their government to carry a gun??
what the H E LL is wrong with the people of Iowa. please correct me if i am wrong about that
 

Fallschirjmäger

Active member
Joined
Aug 4, 2007
Messages
3,826
Location
Cumming, Georgia, USA
Are you saying that the people of Iowa, must have a permission slip from their government to carry a gun??
what the H E LL is wrong with the people of Iowa. please correct me if i am wrong about that
Papa bear, aren't you from a state that requires a permission slip from their government to merely purchase a handgun, even one that's not going to be carried?
 
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