Intent to open carry in Milwaukee

[Parabellum]

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Doug Huffman wrote:

Shotgun wrote:

Careful! I do notknow why you believe thatSt. Martini Lutheran School fails to meet the statutory definition. The school's website says that it is a private school with grades K through 8. That certainly sounds like a "school" under the definition to me.

I wonder what he thinks 'parochial' means?

WI Statute 939.632(1)(a) (a) "School" means a public, parochial or private school that ...

parochial

1. of or pertaining to a parish or parishes.

2. of or pertaining to parochial schools or the education they provide.

3. very limited or narrow in scope or outlook; provincial: parochial views; a parochial mentality.

 

[BB62]

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I suggest you buy yourself an Olympus audio recorder, model VN4100PC (about $60), and a Flip ULTRAaudio/video recorder (about $135 at Sam's Club).

Both are excellent.

 

[Doug Huffman]

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I have a VN4100PC and its associated wave player. I also have 'Wave to Text' that seems pretty klunky on which to spend so much money? Does anyone have any suggestions on a program or protocol that will make transcription easier - without the sometimes interminable waits for the next word?

 

[Shotgun]

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Parabellum wrote:

It does not meet the second requirement of being commonly known as one of the five categories of schools, risky I know, but I could argue that in court. I still think its just a church with some classes underneath.

I think it is a school under the statutory definition. It's an elementary, middle and junior high school. Are there "school crossing" signs in the area of this school? I think it is reasonable to assume the phrase "elementary school, middle school, junior high school, senior high school or high school" is included in the statute in order to EXCLUDE such things as, say, "The Smith School of Dance."

St. Martini Lutheran School is included on the Wisconsin Department of Public Instruction's list of private schools! http://dpi.wi.gov/schlprv.html

Parabellum, what is your purpose in wanting to OC in this particular area? As you say, it is "risky" to argue your interpretation of the statute in court. Is a felony conviction worth this risk?

 

[Parabellum]

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Shotgun wrote:

Parabellum wrote:

It does not meet the second requirement of being commonly known as one of the five categories of schools, risky I know, but I could argue that in court. I still think its just a church with some classes underneath.

I think it is a school under the statutory definition. It's an elementary, middle and junior high school. Are there "school crossing" signs in the area of this school? I think it is reasonable to assume the phrase "elementary school, middle school, junior high school, senior high school or high school" is included in the statute in order to EXCLUDE such things as, say, "The Smith School of Dance."

St. Martini Lutheran School is included on the Wisconsin Department of Public Instruction's list of private schools! http://dpi.wi.gov/schlprv.html

Parabellum, what is your purpose in wanting to OC in this particular area? As you say, it is "risky" to argue your interpretation of the statute in court. Is a felony conviction worth this risk?

You are right. And your a killjoy. That area is notorious for the crime there, and I have my share of enemies(the dangerous kind) living in that area. Is a felony conviction for OC worth it? No. But is it worth risking my life to be disarmed? No. I have to go often enough for private reasons, i usually go when the thugs have gone indoors(I'm unarmed, and i don't like to be). The fact that i did not believe it qualified indemnified me to the extent of a firstcourt appearance, but now I KNOW its a school and I wont be carrying there(somehow the area doesn't seem safer).:banghead:

 

[Shotgun]

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Sorry if I'm a killjoy, but I didn't want you to make a serious mistake. The school zone law is stupid, but even stupid laws can get you arrested and jailed! You are doing great with your OC and I hope you agree that it is done best when you are on a strong legal basis. If you keep it up, it's probably a matter of time (perhaps a short time at the rate you're going) before you have a "close encounter of the 3rd kind" with the police. Good luck!

 

[Mugenlude]

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I've been lurking for awhile, but I just registered.

Parabellum, just wanted to let you know that you are inspiring, keep it up!!!! I look forward to more updates...

 

[Parabellum]

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Ive just been arrested for open carrying, then the charge was changed when they couldnt find that its illegal. I need to talk to people in person about this before I post, is anyone willing to meet? In milwaukee(this is not a joke).PM me or IM me ASAP

 

[apjonas]

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Wow! Public use internet terminals at the police station? Or is it WiFi with your PDA? You were not arrested for "open carrying" - there is no such statute. Please indicate the statute or ordinance that you werecharged with violating - that would help a great deal. You don't need to meet an OCDO member unless said member is an attorney and interested in having you for a client. I am beginning to smell a work of fiction.

Parabellum wrote:

Ive just been arrested for open carrying, then the charge was changed when they couldnt find that its illegal. I need to talk to people in person about this before I post, is anyone willing to meet? In milwaukee(this is not a joke).PM me or IM me ASAP

 

[Parabellum]

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apjonas wrote:

Wow! Public use internet terminals at the police station? Or is it WiFi with your PDA? You were not arrested for "open carrying" - there is no such statute. Please indicated the statute or ordinance that you werecharged with violating - that would help a great deal. You don't need to meet an OCDO member unless said member is an attorney and interested in having you for a client. I beginning to lean towards work of fiction.

Parabellum wrote:

Ive just been arrested for open carrying, then the charge was changed when they couldnt find that its illegal. I need to talk to people in person about this before I post, is anyone willing to meet? In milwaukee(this is not a joke).PM me or IM me ASAP

caareful who you insult and read properly, i was TOLD that i was being aressted because i couldnt have a weaponh then it was changed to disorderly conduct while armed, I am not IN JAIL, i was let go cause i wanted a lawyer so they gave me a piece of paper and sent me home and told me to meet the DA on tuesday

 

[apjonas]

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Parabellum wrote:

apjonas wrote:

Wow! Public use internet terminals at the police station? Or is it WiFi with your PDA? You were not arrested for "open carrying" - there is no such statute. Please indicated the statute or ordinance that you werecharged with violating - that would help a great deal. You don't need to meet an OCDO member unless said member is an attorney and interested in having you for a client. I beginning to lean towards work of fiction.

Parabellum wrote:

Ive just been arrested for open carrying, then the charge was changed when they couldnt find that its illegal. I need to talk to people in person about this before I post, is anyone willing to meet? In milwaukee(this is not a joke).PM me or IM me ASAP

caareful who you insult and read properly, i was TOLD that i was being aressted because i couldnt have a weaponh then it was changed to disorderly conduct while armed, I am not IN JAIL, i was let go cause i wanted a lawyer so they gave me a piece of paper and sent me home and told me to meet the DA on tuesday

I did not mean to insult you and I read your post carefully. Please understand that every post has indicia of being real or not. You did not give much in the way of specifics and requesting to meet "anyone" on OCDO seemed a little strange. I expect the DC charge will be dropped but that's for you and your lawyer. I wouldn't post anything until after the end of the issuebut keep good notes because what you experience will be valuable information. I apologize for any offense and best of luck.

 

[smithman]

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Parabellum wrote:

Ive just been arrested for open carrying, then the charge was changed when they couldnt find that its illegal. I need to talk to people in person about this before I post, is anyone willing to meet? In milwaukee(this is not a joke).PM me or IM me ASAP

Definately keep copious notes about what goes on. How long will it take for them to drop the DC charge, I wonder? Perhaps the DA on Tuesday will drop it outwright then.

So it sounds like you were initially arrested for something the cops THOUGHT was illegal. This means that they are ignorant to the law. If we want to avoid further harrassment we as a group need to TELL them that it is not illegal, and that by DC they are infringing our rights. We need to send letters and emails to local PDs...especially after a county passes our resolution.

We need to get the LEOs talking about it. They may not like it, but luckily rights don't depend on others liking that someone exercises them.

 

[Brigdh]

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Parabellum wrote:

apjonas wrote:

Wow! Public use internet terminals at the police station? Or is it WiFi with your PDA? You were not arrested for "open carrying" - there is no such statute. Please indicated the statute or ordinance that you werecharged with violating - that would help a great deal. You don't need to meet an OCDO member unless said member is an attorney and interested in having you for a client. I beginning to lean towards work of fiction.

Parabellum wrote:

Ive just been arrested for open carrying, then the charge was changed when they couldnt find that its illegal. I need to talk to people in person about this before I post, is anyone willing to meet? In milwaukee(this is not a joke).PM me or IM me ASAP

caareful who you insult and read properly, i was TOLD that i was being aressted because i couldnt have a weaponh then it was changed to disorderly conduct while armed, I am not IN JAIL, i was let go cause i wanted a lawyer so they gave me a piece of paper and sent me home and told me to meet the DA on tuesday

If you feel comfortable, would you please scan any offical paperwork of charges (after redacting your address, etc)? Please, don't take offense, but I would like proof that they actually charged you with DC for open carrying (instead of just taking your word for it). This may in fact prove the myth after all. (there have been several challenges on OCDO for proof of DC from just open carrying)

If you need a lawyer, I think Shotgun on the board here might have a name.

 

[pkbites]

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Brigdh wrote:

If you feel comfortable, would you please scan any offical paperwork of charges (after redacting your address, etc)? Please, don't take offense, but I would like proof that they actually charged you with DC for open carrying (instead of just taking your word for it). This may in fact prove the myth after all. (there have been several challenges on OCDO for proof of DC from just open carrying)

Wsconsin has 2 great resources, CCAP, and The Milwaukee Municipal Court Information web sites. All we need is a case number to track it on line.

Parabellum, you're going to have a credibility issue if you don't supply us with something we can verify.

http://wcca.wicourts.gov/index.xsl;jsessionid=0CE9AE7657F04ADFD05430C932693B36.render5

http://www.ci.mil.wi.us/MunicipalCourt653.htm

 

[apjonas]

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Hey pkbites - What percentage of MKE (or WI) LEO's think that OC is illegal? What percentage think it is DC per se? I know you don't keep stats but just spitball a guess. And pop in on the other WI threads - they need some knowledgeable input.

 

[Shotgun]

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I would venture that few LEO's here believe OC is illegal, and many that it is DC.

As far as my attorney's name, he's in Madison, but if Para is interested....

 

[pkbites]

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apjonas wrote:

Hey pkbites - What percentage of MKE (or WI) LEO's think that OC is illegal? What percentage think it is DC per se? I know you don't keep stats but just spitball a guess. And pop in on the other WI threads - they need some knowledgeable input.

The majority of cops I've talked to know there is no specific law against OC, but I'd estimate 80% think it does qualify as DC. A few are ignorant about the local ordinances against OC being wiped out by the firearms preemption law.

OC here is very rare. In 25+ years I've never made an arrest for it.

 

[Pointman]

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*

 

[Shotgun]

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pkbites wrote:

OC here is very rare. In 25+ years I've never made an arrest for it.

But then, why would you ever? I take that back, I guess you could have arrested under a local ordinance back in the day....

Pkbites, you've probably expressed your opinion elsewhere, but I assume you're among the 20% of LEOs regarding OC=DC?

 

[BB62]

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Pointman wrote:

This does look a bit suspicious, a new member goes out and claims to open carry, has no proof, and then claims he's been arrested...

I agree.