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House Approves Concealed Firearm Permit Bill!!!! YES!!!

thebigsd

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Joined
Mar 23, 2010
Messages
3,539
Location
Quarryville, PA
Not really a great day... The Senate will destroy this bill. If for some impossible reason they pass it then Obama will veto it. This is good. We don't want this bill to pass. There is no need for further federal government intrusion into state's rights.
 
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TheManInBlack

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Jul 19, 2011
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Wi
Any step forward for gun rights is a good step, Veto'd or not... it shows a force of American demand..
 

Baked on Grease

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Sterling, Va.
Not really a great day... The Senate will destroy this bill. If for some impossible reason they pass it then Obama will veto it. This is good. We don't want this bill to pass. There is no need for further federal government intrusion into state's rights.

Yes and no.

Yes in that I don't want the Feds to be able to make their own rules about it. No in that the only Federal gun bill that is good is one that preempts states from making laws that restrict beyond what the 2nd amendment allows them to...

Sent using tapatalk
 

Daylen

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Aug 29, 2010
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This has the potential to be really bad. It will probably die in the senate. The question is how will antigunners spin it. If it dies quietly then it will be ok. If it gets attention it could help tyrants point to something as a win. If it gets vetoed by the Pres it could go either way, really bad because antigunners show up in force to support him or really good because middle of the road gun owners decide against him; it will have a big impact if it makes it to him one way or the other. I hate to think what might happen if the Pres signs it, but I don't think it will make it to him. I hope someone is ready to use any votes against this bill to beat up certain congressmen; passing a bill like this as a statement is stupid.
 

RetiredOC

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Dec 21, 2009
Messages
1,567
Not really a great day... The Senate will destroy this bill. If for some impossible reason they pass it then Obama will veto it. This is good. We don't want this bill to pass. There is no need for further federal government intrusion into state's rights.

Big SD. My man. You're right, we don't want federal intrusion into state's rights. But the states have intruded into the WE THE PEOPLE's rights. Since the constitution doesn't mean crap and the states are allowed to shred the constitution, (specifically amendment number 2 in this case) this bill is doing something unconstitutional to fight something unconstitutional. In a country where the constitution is dead and the American voters have abandoned the American revolution and the idea of freedom - I think this is the best we can do for now.
 

thebigsd

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Quarryville, PA
Big SD. My man. You're right, we don't want federal intrusion into state's rights. But the states have intruded into the WE THE PEOPLE's rights. Since the constitution doesn't mean crap and the states are allowed to shred the constitution, (specifically amendment number 2 in this case) this bill is doing something unconstitutional to fight something unconstitutional. In a country where the constitution is dead and the American voters have abandoned the American revolution and the idea of freedom - I think this is the best we can do for now.

Isn't that like two wrongs don't make a right? :D

I see where you're coming from but this bill still doesn't allow folks to carry in DC or Illinois. I may be a step forward but it is a dangerous one.
 

ComradeV

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Feb 17, 2009
Messages
429
Location
Maple Hill, North Carolina, USA
Constitution

I would have to disagree with the notion that states have rights. They have powers(or authority) that is granted to them by the People of the United States of America. This seems to be specifically what the Federal government's job is; the job of protecting the rights of the People, because people have rights, from the abuse of those rights by the authority of the State governments.

If the law granted more powers of regulation to the Federal government, than that would make it something requiring strong scrutiny. Since it merely restores the right of citizens which we should have(the equal protection of our immunities and privileges) then it seems to be constitutional for the Feds to mandate that the States respect our right.
 

Daylen

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Messages
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America
I would have to disagree with the notion that states have rights. They have powers(or authority) that is granted to them by the People of the United States of America. This seems to be specifically what the Federal government's job is; the job of protecting the rights of the People, because people have rights, from the abuse of those rights by the authority of the State governments.

If the law granted more powers of regulation to the Federal government, than that would make it something requiring strong scrutiny. Since it merely restores the right of citizens which we should have(the equal protection of our immunities and privileges) then it seems to be constitutional for the Feds to mandate that the States respect our right.

"The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people."
As you say there are no "rights" of states. I see nowhere in the 10th amendment or anywhere in the constitution mention of governments having Rights, only powers. This is important, because powers can be taken away, though it is important to keep power from being centralized to the feds.
 

RetiredOC

Campaign Veteran
Joined
Dec 21, 2009
Messages
1,567
Isn't that like two wrongs don't make a right? :D

you gotta ask yourself one question; is it wrong to attempt to salvage whats left of the 2A after its been trampled by the states since the 2A will never be enforced as it is written?
 

ixtow

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Joined
Nov 25, 2006
Messages
5,038
Location
Suwannee County, FL
Not really a great day... The Senate will destroy this bill. If for some impossible reason they pass it then Obama will veto it. This is good. We don't want this bill to pass. There is no need for further federal government intrusion into state's rights.

This.
 

ixtow

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Joined
Nov 25, 2006
Messages
5,038
Location
Suwannee County, FL
Amash, Justin (MI)
Dold, Robert (IL)
Grimm, Michael (NY)
King, Pete (NY)
Lungren, Daniel E. (CA)
Turner, Robert (NY)
Woodall, Robert (GA)

Might want to find out WHY they downvoted it before you hang em high... This is a very bad bill and they may have been the only ones paying attention.

It won't get past the senate anyway. For the wrong reasons... But I'm glad it isn't going to happen. It only erodes State's Rights, and further solidifies the permit concept as acceptable tyranny. There should be no permits, and no need for reciprocity. Inflating the Fed Guv even more is not what we need.
 
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Brimstone Baritone

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 26, 2010
Messages
786
Location
Leeds, Alabama, USA
Any step forward for gun rights is a good step, Veto'd or not... it shows a force of American demand..

The ends do not justify the means. Especially when the 'means' is further erosion of the Constitution, and the 'ends' is a dubious strengthening of the PERMISSION to keep and bear arms. What Congress giveth, Congress can also take away.

As for American demand... politicians pandering to the national majority is what got us into this mess. Our representatives should be representing their voting constituents, not toeing a party line and usurping more power for themselves and their cronies. We need a return to the Constitutional Republic this nation was founded as, not more feel good placebos from big government.
 

hermannr

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 24, 2011
Messages
2,330
Location
Okanogan Highland
What I see is people that have another agenda are against this bill.

HR822 was specificially written to stay within the constitution. Here is a very good analysis of HR 822 verses what the constitution states: http://davekopel.org/Testimony/HR822-Kopel.pdf

Take the time to read it before you slam the bill. Also, it will be years before we get some relief from the courts. I am sure it will not happen in my lifetime.

There are practical things here too. This has a chance. last year a very similar bill almost made it through the Senate...Harry Reid even voted for it. Another small point. a presidential veto would be political suicide...you don't think so.

Here in WA the Brady type "ceasefire WA" has 5000 members. There are over 345,000 ACTIVE CPL's in WA. How do you like them odds? Do you think any politico is going to anger that kind of margin in an election year? Get 5000 angry at you, or 500,000?

This law may upset a larger margin in NY and NJ, but I'll still bet that even in those states there are potentially more pro 2A voters then true anti 2A,
 
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