Bin Laden is dead!

[marshaul]

So, now that he's gone, can we scale back the defense budget and get out of Afghanistan and Iraq?

+100000

 

[marshaul]

President Obama has proven that he is not afraid of, nor hesitant about putting a bullet in the head of a terrorist.

He did that!?

I didn't know our president was shooting people these days.

 

[marshaul]

IMO we should become independant of foreign oil...

Well we're sure going to accomplish that by preventing the market from fostering such independence, by constantly subsidizing/enabling the success of foreign-oil business with military intervention.

 

[marshaul]

I could go on about this, but at the heart of all this is that people are under the illusion that a 'smaller government' is going to solve all of our problems. Get real people. America is competing with States that have a much bigger role in the lives of their people. There are no absolutes such as 'freedom', and a government so small it can stand on the head of a pin, and we still function as a State. Our individual failures to realize the world that we must compete with, that are ill-prepared children must compete with is going to be the downfall of America. And we (Americans) are going to be bogged down in political BS, misinformation, and some individualistic, self-diluted sense that our neighbor, and/or ourselves struggling everyday to live paycheck to paycheck has nothing to do with the consumerist society that we have become, and the distrustful people that we have become about our Government, and our neighbor. We are our enemy - mark my words, that enemy is going to take us down quicker than we think.

Good luck people.

You're super-smart.

Anyone who burns an American flag either overseas, or in the states, should be executed. The latter for treason.

For the first time in my life, I really want to burn a flag. I suppose it's just something I could do to bother you a fraction as much as you do me.

I'm not going to demean myself or this forum by articulating exactly what I think of you.

I will say that I've just observed a rather delicious irony in what you've tried to do with your sig line there, juxtaposed with the views you've expressed in this forum.

Wonderful person. Yup.

 

[marshaul]

Because he buys into the myth that the price of oil depends on our presence in the middle east. Of course, this is easy to debunk. During the course of the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq, the price of oil has ranged from very low to very high. The main reason for today's high prices is the unrest in the middle east (nothing to do with us) combined with our moronic unwillingness to tap our own resources.

And of course we have nothing to do with any unrest in the middle east.

Also, of course, we have never invaded any oil producers and installed puppet governments. And our not doing this, of course, has no effect on the market competitiveness of local resources vs. foreign oil.



You're also super-smart.

 

[Jack House]

The best conspiracy theory I have heard so far is that they captured him, faked his death photos and staged the funeral at sea so that no one could check on the body. Meanwhile he is holed up in a secure prison for extensive interrogation.
Dead or Alive, I don't care so long as he never sees the light of day and we never have to hear his name again.

If this is the case, then I could care less. It'd actually be one of the few times that I would agree with the government lying about something.

I am indifferent to the theories. But everyone so quick to dismiss them and fully trust the government seem to have no memory whatsoever. After all, the Project Gunrunner saga is still ongoing.

 

[markand]

Unfortunately, I think this is far more plausible than the story we're getting: When the helicopters hit that compound, Bin Laden's body guards did exactly what they were trained and instructed to do. They blew Bin Laden's brains out before anybody else could touch him. He was dead and assuming room temperature when the Seals walked through that 3rd floor door. No firefight, at least not in that room. No resistance. I can't conceive a scenario where Bin Laden or his people would let him come close to being captured alive.

But that's not the story the administration wanted to tell. Not a story that will get this president re-elected. And that's what this is all about - getting this president re-elected. Every implausible and shifting story coming from the administration. Every bit of spin. Every sound bite. Every photo op in NYC and ground zero. Its all about getting the president re-elected.

Right from the beginning, the facts started getting twisted and spun. I have no doubt the delay from when they asked for air time to when the president stepped up to the microphone was to try to get the spin straight as facts were still coming in. So they start telling lies or telling the story in a way that leaves an impression different from the facts. Like we killed him in a firefight. But lies have to be told to cover the earlier lies and try to line up with facts that do become known. We'll never see the videos, and I have no doubt that everybody on that team had helmet or rifle mounted video or both. And those death photos, that we're never going to see, will probably show wounds that wouldn't be possible if he was shot in a fire fight, but are consistent with shots at contact or near contact distance. And if he wasn't killed in a fire fight, but was killed by the Seals, then he was captured, held, then coldly executed by shots to the head at contact range. Personally, I wouldn't mind that, but I'm not sure the cold blooded execution of an enemy combatant already in custody, perhaps even trying to surrender, is a story the administration wants to defend. Even if that story turns out to be the truth. Not even sure its legal, regardless of what some executive order says. Given all the restraint imposed on troops in combat today, I'd be amazed if an execution order were ever given. Prior to the end of the mission that is.

So the spin goes on....

 

[Jack House]

They were bound to screw up eventually. 10 years is a good run.

 

[jbone]

snip..When the helicopters hit that compound, Bin Laden's body guards did exactly what they were trained and instructed to do. They blew Bin Laden's brains out before anybody else could touch him.

First we all know Osama is a coward, no way he would have a allowed one of his lovers, I mean courrier's to waste him, and that he was not reaching for a gun but a pork chop as a offering of friendship.

 

[Beretta92FSLady]

For the first time in my life, I really want to burn a flag. I suppose it's just something I could do to bother you a fraction as much as you do me.

I'm not going to demean myself or this forum by articulating exactly what I think of you.

I will say that I've just observed a rather delicious irony in what you've tried to do with your sig line there, juxtaposed with the views you've expressed in this forum.

Wonderful person. Yup.

Individuals who burn the American Flag should be exectuted. I don't view the burning of a Flag itsefelf as an executable offense. The intent behind burning the Flag goes deeper than the material the Flag is made of that can be burned. Burning the American Flag is an attack against what America represents.

Excessive? So be it.

*looks around* Well, that's the only thing worth responding to.

 

[marshaul]

Individuals who burn the American Flag should be exectuted. I don't view the burning of a Flag itsefelf as an executable offense. The intent behind burning the Flag goes deeper than the material the Flag is made of that can be burned. Burning the American Flag is an attack against what America represents.

Ecessive? So be it.

You're disgusting.

I'm seriously going to burn a flag now, just for you.

Should I be executed? Is that treason?

What a joke!

For the record, the American flag doesn't represent American culture, values, "what America represents", or any of that stuff.

It represents our government (the C.S.A. didn't use the U.S. flag. Different government.). Government for which support is, or should be, contingent upon our liberties and rights being respected.

Many individuals who burn flags would like to kill Americans. Many Americans burn flags in disgust with their government. These motivations, and the potential danger they represent to America, are not even in the same ballpark. And yet you would execute all of these people simply due to your interpretation of what flag burning means, regardless of their own motivation. You would execute me as a traitor, despite the fact that I am only going to burn my flag because it upsets you so much. My reasoning has nothing to do with "what America represents". Ridiculous.

In my opinion, your view is as traitorous to "what America represents", i.e. liberty, freedom of speech, freedom from oppression, freedom to criticize government, etc, as that of any fanatical America-hater who burns a flag.

At least I wouldn't have you executed.

Like I said, you're disgusting. What "America represents" to you is very different from myself. Your arguments would be viewed favorably by both of the clown in your sig line, but they are not American. The irony of your espousing such anti-American views in the name of defending "what America represents" is as great as that created by your sig line itself.

 

[Beretta92FSLady]

You're disgusting.

I'm seriously going to burn a flag now, just for you.

Should I be executed? Is that treason?

What a joke!

For the record, the American flag doesn't represent American culture, values, "what America represents", or any of that stuff.

It represents our government (the C.S.A. didn't use the U.S. flag. Different government.). Government for which support is, or should be, contingent upon our liberties and rights being respected.

Many individuals who burn flags would like to kill Americans. Many Americans burn flags in disgust with their government. These motivations, and the potential danger they represent to America, are not even in the same ballpark. And yet you would execute all of these people simply due to your interpretation of what flag burning means, regardless of their own motivation. You would execute me as a traitor, despite the fact that I am only going to burn my flag because it upsets you so much. My reasoning has nothing to do with "what America represents". Ridiculous.

In my opinion, your view is as traitorous to "what America represents", i.e. liberty, freedom of speech, freedom from oppression, freedom to criticize government, etc, as that of any fanatical America-hater who burns a flag.

At least I wouldn't have you executed.

Like I said, you're disgusting. What "America represents" to you is very different from myself. Your arguments would be viewed favorably by both of the clown in your sig line, but they are not American. The irony of your espousing such anti-American views in the name of defending "what America represents" is as great as that created by your sig line itself.

*yawn* Just another re-hashing of responders that came before you.

Individuals who burn the American Flag should be executed, and I outlined my reasoning above. I didn't say that I would execute any person, I said that a person should be executed. Take it or leave it.

 

[marshaul]

Individuals who burn the American Flag should be executed, and I outlined my reasoning above. I didn't say that I would execute any person, I said that a person should be executed. Take it or leave it.

What is your point? You're not going to do the executions yourself? Big whoop.

I'd like to know why you hate America and the freedom it represents so much. Why do you take the side of corrupted government over our values, traditions, and culture?

You are not an Americanist, but a statist. This is nothing new, of course.

You have redefined American values as those values which you hold, and you would seek to have executed a great many of those who would disagree with you.

 

[Beretta92FSLady]

What is your point? You're not going to do the executions yourself? Big whoop.

I'd like to know why you hate America and the freedom it represents so much.

I'll bite...for now.

What is 'America' (to you), what is 'freedom' (to you), and what 'freedom' does your America represent? Once you explain those items, and how they relate to your 'American Freedom', I will respond.

I don't need to know why you are asserting that I "hate" America - that will be evident in your response to the items I oulined above for you to respond to.

 

[Beretta92FSLady]

You are not an Americanist, but a statist. This is nothing new, of course.

You have redefined American values as those values which you hold, and you would seek to have executed a great many of those who would disagree with you.

What exactly do you mean by 'Americanist'?

So-called 'American values' are defined, and assigned by individuals. I have never stated that those who disagree with me should be executed.

 

[Beretta92FSLady]

Unfortunately, I think this is far more plausible than the story we're getting: When the helicopters hit that compound, Bin Laden's body guards did exactly what they were trained and instructed to do. They blew Bin Laden's brains out before anybody else could touch him. He was dead and assuming room temperature when the Seals walked through that 3rd floor door. No firefight, at least not in that room. No resistance. I can't conceive a scenario where Bin Laden or his people would let him come close to being captured alive.

But that's not the story the administration wanted to tell. Not a story that will get this president re-elected. And that's what this is all about - getting this president re-elected. Every implausible and shifting story coming from the administration. Every bit of spin. Every sound bite. Every photo op in NYC and ground zero. Its all about getting the president re-elected.

Right from the beginning, the facts started getting twisted and spun. I have no doubt the delay from when they asked for air time to when the president stepped up to the microphone was to try to get the spin straight as facts were still coming in. So they start telling lies or telling the story in a way that leaves an impression different from the facts. Like we killed him in a firefight. But lies have to be told to cover the earlier lies and try to line up with facts that do become known. We'll never see the videos, and I have no doubt that everybody on that team had helmet or rifle mounted video or both. And those death photos, that we're never going to see, will probably show wounds that wouldn't be possible if he was shot in a fire fight, but are consistent with shots at contact or near contact distance. And if he wasn't killed in a fire fight, but was killed by the Seals, then he was captured, held, then coldly executed by shots to the head at contact range. Personally, I wouldn't mind that, but I'm not sure the cold blooded execution of an enemy combatant already in custody, perhaps even trying to surrender, is a story the administration wants to defend. Even if that story turns out to be the truth. Not even sure its legal, regardless of what some executive order says. Given all the restraint imposed on troops in combat today, I'd be amazed if an execution order were ever given. Prior to the end of the mission that is.

So the spin goes on....

*sniggers*

 

[Tawnos]

So Beretta, you think that people who properly dispose of a tattered old flag should be executed?

Citation

 

[bomber]

He did that!?

I didn't know our president was shooting people these days.

in between sessions of stroking his peace prize, he's actually an IDPA champion shooter, making headshots from thousands of miles away seem like childs play

 

[bomber]

What exactly do you mean by 'Americanist'?

So-called 'American values' are defined, and assigned by individuals. I have never stated that those who disagree with me should be executed.

i disagree with you. i can and will burn an american flag at my own discretion.

 

[bomber]

*yawn* Just another re-hashing of responders that came before you.

Individuals who burn the American Flag should be executed, and I outlined my reasoning above. I didn't say that I would execute any person, I said that a person should be executed. Take it or leave it.

so you want people to die if they burn the flag, but you don't want to get your hands dirty. come on, where are your convictions?