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Spread Sheet - County/City Ordinances - Stop & ID, CHP Reqs, Airguns, & Park Bans

d dubya

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 31, 2012
Messages
8
Location
Williamsburg, VA

Marco

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 29, 2007
Messages
3,905
Location
Greene County
This is my former hometown. Yes, this guy is a jerk.

I'll be OC'ing in the parks next Saturday. With bail arrangements in place.:D

If it were me I wouldn't sweat it. I do recommend having the # to your attorney on you/memorized.
If it were me and I was hassled I'd insist the officer contact the Town's police Chief (for clarification and course of action) before things progressed to a point where mere words couldn't fix.


Good luck...
I'll be in the area later in the yr
 

TFred

Regular Member
Joined
Oct 13, 2008
Messages
7,750
Location
Most historic town in, Virginia, USA
Repealing Fingerprint Ordinances

Anybody been making contact with their local legislators on repealing the fingerprint requirements from local ordinances? This is June, now is the time for them to be updating their ordinances if they want to stay in compliance after July 1st.

:)

TFred
 

Wolf_shadow

Activist Member
Joined
Jul 5, 2006
Messages
1,215
Location
Accomac, Virginia, USA
Anybody been making contact with their local legislators on repealing the fingerprint requirements from local ordinances? This is June, now is the time for them to be updating their ordinances if they want to stay in compliance after July 1st.

:)

TFred
I notified Accomack County. Of course they have ignored me before. I contacted VCDL President before about going after them, but haven't heard anymore about it.
 

Marco

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 29, 2007
Messages
3,905
Location
Greene County
Greene County Board of Supervisors voted last night 7/24/12 to apporve the Proposed Amendment to the Firearms Discharge Ordinance.

None of the BOS had anything to say other than to approve and thank me for bringing this to their attention but the County Attny. apparently had some issues with the "reasonable care to prevent a projecticle from crossing the bounds of the property" however he was smart enough to stiffle his comments especially with two media outlets there recording this meeting. My guess is he has his eye on a higher postion in local/state gov't and doesn't want his anti comments to come back to haunt....

greenecodischargeamend001.jpg
 

Grapeshot

Legendary Warrior
Joined
May 21, 2006
Messages
35,331
Location
Valhalla
Greene County Board of Supervisors voted last night 7/24/12 to apporve the Proposed Amendment to the Firearms Discharge Ordinance.

None of the BOS had anything to say other than to approve and thank me for bringing this to their attention but the County Attny. apparently had some issues with the "reasonable care to prevent a projecticle from crossing the bounds of the property" however he was smart enough to stiffle his comments especially with two media outlets there recording this meeting. My guess is he has his eye on a higher postion in local/state gov't and doesn't want his anti comments to come back to haunt....

Nice job Marco - good work.
 
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builtjeep

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 13, 2008
Messages
323
Location
South Chesterfield, VA
I emailed the Petersburg City council this morning in reference to 74-205 and 74-210. I will update IF I get a reply. Looking at the spreadsheet it appears that Dennis O'Connor has some involvement in this, but the spreadsheet shows last update being 2011. This city is pretty obstinate, so we'll see where this all goes.
 

builtjeep

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 13, 2008
Messages
323
Location
South Chesterfield, VA
Re: Spread Sheet - Count/City Ordinances - Stop & ID, CHP Reqs, Airguns, & Park Bans

Well, it's been a week, the city council seems to have no interest in following state law. Big Surprise there.

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2
 

Grapeshot

Legendary Warrior
Joined
May 21, 2006
Messages
35,331
Location
Valhalla
Well, it's been a week, the city council seems to have no interest in following state law. Big Surprise there.

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2

Exactly why premption needs some sharp teeth in it - like Florida's statute wherein the individual(s) may be held responsible to a tune of $5K.

Still we are a Dillon Rule state - if the Commonwealth doesn't specifically allow such ordinance(s) then it is not valid. In this we are first and foremost citizens of Virginia and should enjoy some parity.
http://definitions.uslegal.com/d/dillons-rule/
 

builtjeep

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 13, 2008
Messages
323
Location
South Chesterfield, VA
Exactly why premption needs some sharp teeth in it - like Florida's statute wherein the individual(s) may be held responsible to a tune of $5K.

Still we are a Dillon Rule state - if the Commonwealth doesn't specifically allow such ordinance(s) then it is not valid. In this we are first and foremost citizens of Virginia and should enjoy some parity.
http://definitions.uslegal.com/d/dillons-rule/

Re-sent my email to the City Manager this morning, he just replied saying that he had forwarded it to the City Attorney. We shall see.
 

builtjeep

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 13, 2008
Messages
323
Location
South Chesterfield, VA
Re-sent my email to the City Manager this morning, he just replied saying that he had forwarded it to the City Attorney. We shall see.

Spoke with PVC last week, after hearing from both of us, the City Attorney had contacted PVC to let him know that the revisions have been placed on the City Council's schedule and the codes should be off the books by July 2nd.
 

Adenosine

Regular Member
Joined
Dec 8, 2011
Messages
13
Location
VA
Reply back from the Chief of Police, Strasburg VA
The town has no plans to change our ordinance at this time, anything that fires a projectile will remain illegal, within the town.

Thank you.

Original email
Chief -------,
I wanted to bring to your attention ordinance section:

Sec. 54-317. - Discharging slingshots, airguns or similar implements.
It shall be unlawful for any person to discharge or use any slingshot, sling, gravel shooter, airgun, bow, crossbow or similar implement in the town.

(Code 1968, § 32-2; Code 1983, § 11-138)

As of July 1, 2011 SB757 (http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp504.exe?111+sum+SB757) went into effect. I believe the new state code is as follows: http://lis.virginia.gov/cgi-bin/legp...?111+ful+SB757

I just wanted to make sure that the town of Strasburg agrees with the above information.

Thank you,
------- -----
 
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MSG Laigaie

Campaign Veteran
Joined
Jan 10, 2011
Messages
3,216
Location
Philipsburg, Montana
.........however he was smart enough to stiffle his comments especially with two media outlets there recording this meeting. My guess is he has his eye on a higher postion in local/state gov't and doesn't want his anti comments to come back to haunt....

Do you really want someone of this caliber (no pun int) moving UP in your government?
 

Adenosine

Regular Member
Joined
Dec 8, 2011
Messages
13
Location
VA
Further dialog...

The town has no plans to change our ordinance at this time, anything that fires a projectile will remain illegal, within the town.

Thank you for the reply. The change to Virginian Code 15.2-915.4 allows someone on private property to be able to discharge an air gun as long as they have permission from the property owner to do so and reasonable care is taken to ensure that the projectile does not cross the bounds of the property. Any local ordinances to the contrary, which many localities have adopted, are preempted.

The towns ordinance specifically pertaining to air guns is judicially declared void as to private property owners. To clarify, are you stating your officers plan to illegally enforce this part of the towns ordinance with complete disregard to the Virginian Code of our Common Wealth?

We will enforce the law, code and town charter as appropriate.
 

TFred

Regular Member
Joined
Oct 13, 2008
Messages
7,750
Location
Most historic town in, Virginia, USA
Further dialog...
IMHO, the town attorney and the Mayor are who you should be talking to. The Chief of Police is just an employee.

The website doesn't reveal a town attorney. The only club we have at this point is that they are potentially on the hook for reimbursement of legal fees if they are sued. It's that exposure to liability that might get their attention.

Of course, some local governments are just plain hard-headed. I've been working on Stafford County ever since the ordinance first went live, and even after their Chairman of the Board of Supervisors ran for the Republican nomination for state-wide office and promised repeatedly that she would fix it, still no action whatsoever.

TFred

ETA: It's been a while since we talked any details about localities that willfully and intentionally violate preemption. The aspect that I would love to hear an expert opinion on (hint: User!) is what options would one have if, after being duly informed by some such communication that their local ordinances are preempted and therefore invalid, the local Boss Hogg decided to arrest you for shooting a BB gun in your back yard anyway? Could one pursue charges of kidnapping (for the illegal arrest), malicious prosecution, unlawful imprisonment, etc, etc?
 
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Adenosine

Regular Member
Joined
Dec 8, 2011
Messages
13
Location
VA
I agree with all of the above, yet a town with 6,000 to it, I'm doubtful they have a full time town attorney. To follow up I contacted the council board members who are in charge of the towns ordinances; but, it's always a curiosity to see where your LEOs stand when it comes to enforcement. To me, I think for them it's like being stuck between a rock and a hard place. Duty to enforce the ordinances on the books, but also a duty to the Code of Virginia. I hope they have the oversight to do what is right, but as it stands, I think you're still rolling the dice until the town changes its ordinances to be updated with the Common Wealth's.
 

Blk97F150

Regular Member
Joined
Dec 21, 2010
Messages
1,180
Location
Virginia
Just sent this to the City of Alexandria Police via a webform on their website:


http://request.alexandriava.gov/CCC/?#tab=Index&service=APD_SUGGES

On the following page of your website is this comment:

"No firearm or airgun (BB) can be discharged within the City limits except by law enforcement officers in the performance of their duties."

http://alexandriava.gov/police/info/default.aspx?id=978

That is an incorrect statement, and contrary to the Code of Virginia, which permits BB guns to be fired on private property provided reasonable care is used to keep the projectile within the bounds of the property.

http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp504.exe?000+cod+15.2-915.4

(B) No such ordinance authorized by subsection A shall prohibit the use of pneumatic guns at facilities approved for shooting ranges, on other property where firearms may be discharged, or on or within private property with permission of the owner or legal possessor thereof when conducted with reasonable care to prevent a projectile from crossing the bounds of the property.

I request that you please update your website to bring it in compliance with the Code of Virginia.

Please inform me when this change has been made.

Thank you for your prompt attention to this matter.
 
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