Smith & Wesson SD9VE. WTF?

[solus]

It would be nice if you too took this argument to PMs.

I could care less what you two think of each other.

And let the tread get back to the S@W.

you are, of course correct FI,

let’ recap a bit shall we?
as the OP, a veteran 20-30 year FFL, initially pointed out on a SD9VE (a model which has been on the market +/- five years)

• the firearm’s mags had difficulty loading 16 cartridges then buldged to the point the mags alledgedly couldn’t be loaded into the firearm,
• during his ‘testing’ of the firearm using 10 mags to run 1k of ammo though the firearm all the while the firearm’s slide mechanism allegedly consistently failed to seat itself when the mag was empty,
• where the OP allegedly attempted, but apparently was unsuccessfully, to affect repairs on the firearm

that cover it?

back on point...
the OP has now, after doing due diligence on the WWW, reached the conclusion from some random sites ALL the firearm’s malfunction(s) are directly attributable to the “MAGs”!

ALL ten mags, running 1k of ammo, means each mag should have been used at least 7 times, are ALL deficient and caused the firearm’s slide mechanism to consistently fail...sorry this member finds that to be quite a statistical anomaly!

is that a ham sandwich i smell in Denmark....

oh, OP, after 20-30 years as an FFL you might wish to locate different distributors - most will accept their defective merchandise back for legitimate reasons~ tho not if the unit hasn’t been putz’d with by novices...

btw, please advise where you are posting the used and defective SD9VE (remember selling a firearm as new isn’t ethical) for sale to ensure our members don’t inadvertantly buy the hunk of metal you putz’d with.

is that back on track enough?

 

[pkbites]

Talked to S&W today. They stated that it probably is the mags and started telling to dismantle them and check for kinks in the spring and a couple of other things. I adamantly rejected that and insisted this is not acceptable for a new weapon or new mags. So they are sending me a pre-paid Fed Ex pack and it's going back to the factory.

Looks like this will not be the affordable pistol I wanted to offer. I'm not sticking my customers with such problems.

But I have another pistol to review that I took out today.

When the SD9 comes back from smith I'll post an update here.

In the mean time, if anyone else has experience with it, please do tell. As it looks like the Mods are not going to close this train wreck like I requested.

 

[WalkingWolf]

Talked to S&W today. They stated that it probably is the mags and started telling to dismantle them and check for kinks in the spring and a couple of other things. I adamantly rejected that and insisted this is not acceptable for a new weapon or new mags. So they are sending me a pre-paid Fed Ex pack and it's going back to the factory.

Looks like this will not be the affordable pistol I wanted to offer. I'm not sticking my customers with such problems.

But I have another pistol to review that I took out today.

When the SD9 comes back from smith I'll post an update here.

In the mean time, if anyone else has experience with it, please do tell. As it looks like the Mods are not going to close this train wreck like I requested.

Well I have seen dozens of reviews, and members of both S&W forums have raved about the value, and reliable dependability of the SDVE. No offense but I believe the problem is with the nut behind the wheel.

 

[Firearms Iinstuctor]

Well I have seen dozens of reviews, and members of both S&W forums have raved about the value, and reliable dependability of the SDVE. No offense but I believe the problem is with the nut behind the wheel.

No matter how good the company is they can and do turn out lemons now and then.

After all these things are made on assembly lines.

 

[Grapeshot]

No matter how good the company is they can and do turn out lemons now and then.

After all these things are made on assembly lines.

Coulda been a Kimber...:uhoh:

 

[solus]

No matter how good the company is they can and do turn out lemons now and then.

After all these things are made on assembly lines.

Firearms Iinstructor, et al, you might be right but you seem to have forgotten the OP’s apparent business plan prime directive ~ buy cheep sell to make a good margin

business motto every business major learned in bus 101: you gets whatcha pay for!

 

[Firearms Iinstuctor]

Firearms Iinstructor, et al, you might be right but you seem to have forgotten the OP’s apparent business plan prime directive ~ buy cheep sell to make a good margin

business motto every business major learned in bus 101: you gets whatcha pay for!

Buy low sell high as always been a business motto.

Most people go into business to make money.

 

[gutshot II]

Firearms Iinstructor, et al, you might be right but you seem to have forgotten the OP’s apparent business plan prime directive ~ buy cheep sell to make a good margin

business motto every business major learned in bus 101: you gets whatcha pay for!

Nonsense!

I don't know of many businesses that buy high and sell low. At least, not intentionally. They wouldn't last very long. People that are actually in business, as opposed to just those just studying it, find out quickly which is the better strategy.

Nobody gets what they pay for every time. I have paid for lots of things that I didn't get and have gotten lots of things that I didn't pay for, or want. A better motto is "caveat emptor" (let the buyer beware).

 

[pkbites]

It's been brought to my attention that I need to clear something up.

Smith and Wesson is a manufacturer, not a distributor. Dealers buy guns from distributors, not manufacturers. When a gun is defective it gets sent to the manufacturer for repair or replacement, not the distributor. The distributor is a middle man between the dealer and manufacturer.

Not sure if some of you were aware of this factor.

 

[solus]

It's been brought to my attention that I need to clear something up.

Smith and Wesson is a manufacturer, not a distributor. Dealers buy guns from distributors, not manufacturers. When a gun is defective it gets sent to the manufacturer for repair or replacement, not the distributor. The distributor is a middle man between the dealer and manufacturer.

Not sure if some of you were aware of this factor.

As previously stated, you are apparently dealing with the wrong distributors...are you sure you're dealing with front line distributors?

 

[Firearms Iinstuctor]

As previously stated, you are apparently dealing with the wrong distributors...are you sure you're dealing with front line distributors?

So solus because you seem to know so much about the business please tell us about your firearm business and how many years you have been in it. Then we can defer to your great knowledge and wisdom.

I know FFL holders I don't think any of them send defective firearms, caused by company that manufactured them back to the distributors. Unless they would be a factory warrantee station also. But most are not.

Now if the firearm was damage in shipping or other damage that should have been noticed by the distributor they would get it back. But a defect from the company that manufactured it no. As with most every thing there could be exceptions.


Most firearms have factory seals on the boxes the distributor only look at the labels to match the order.

A function problem wouldn't be noticed 99 percent of time until the customer took it home and shot it.

 

[solus]

So solus because you seem to know so much about the business please tell us about your firearm business and how many years you have been in it.

I know FFL holders I don't think any of them send defective firearms, caused by company that manufactured them back to the distributors. Unless they would be a factory warrantee station also. But most are not.

Now if the firearm was damage in shipping or other damage that should have been noticed by the distributor they would get it back. But a defect from the company that manufactured it no.


Most firearms have factory seals on the boxes the distributor only look at the labels to match the order.

A function problem wouldn't be noticed 99 percent of time until the customer took it home and shot it.

so FI, et al, first i am not talking about big box retailers who purchase products directly from manuf...

according to the OP, they buy a resale unit, apparently in volume, and supposedly over a signifcant period of time ~ this buying of resale units labels this individual as a retailer, or merchant, who has developed a relationship w/a distr who is in the business of wholesaling an industry product wanted by consumers.

now, promos or sales on excess distr stock notwithstanding, on the whole there is very little ‘wholesale’ cost difference between distr, some listed here: http://www.gunnersden.com/index.htm.gun-dealers-distributors.html . please do not forget shipping, in some cases runs $30/unit.

in fact, if an individual looks around, bud’s at times is CHEAPER than wholesale distr w/free shipping BUT remember bud’s isn't a wholesaler to merchant and of course bud’s has no need to assure customer loyality whatsoever.

btw,the industry manuf, have dealer buy promo, e.g. buy six get a seventh ‘free’ & pay over three month period, and each of these distr offer exactly the same manuf promo conditions to their merchant buying customers. you notice the is no consideration extended by the manuf to the wholesaler to change terms for high volume retailers to obtain say buy 10 units, get four free! ( some distr did have a tier system but when the economy went south they ended the concept as it didn’t result in more outbound volume for the distr)

now buying from the same or several distr for a period of time a ‘relationship’ develops and when defective product, cosmetic or mechanical, is received or damaged in transit, the distr in good faith to their loyal merchant customer, WILL offer a RMA to exchange the defective unit.

please do not forget, if Le, active/retired or NRA instructor/TC can avail themselves to industry manufacturers direct buy, close to or lower than wholesale, incentive pgms for these gaggles of stauch customers!

now, you are partially correct, but remember a customer in a store looking at a display unit, buys it, sales says let me get one in a box, AND the customer doesn’t insist the box be opened to inspect the unit being purchased right then in front of the clerk is an idiot!

oh wait, if the merchant, unless dealling w/huge volumes, doesn’t physically inspect their receiving, are idiots. box content, proper mags, right mdl, e.g. no safety, sight, lh vs rh, lock, spent cartridge, etc.

whole cottage industry ~ bus 318: supply chain management and some industries acct receivable dept won't pay vendors w/o an operational test being accomplished by QA and the receiving document so stamped.

finally FI, et al., if an FFL doesn’t open and verify S/N on the unit, then on the box, while completing their A&D w/in prescribed timeframes their names change from merchant to felon and out of business.

bus 101 ~ applicability to cars, produce, housse, hardware, ad nauseam.

as stated, to discern there is a possible problem but continue on running 1k through the unit using 10 mags and apparently discerning their is a real malfunction as the slide does remain open when the mag is empty and then attempts to fix it themself all the while planning on selling the unit to one of their customers isn’t an experienced merchant, they are (blanked out by this poster)

that satisfy your itch FI?

 

[FBrinson]

So solus because you seem to know so much about the business please tell us about your firearm business and how many years you have been in it. Then we can defer to your great knowledge and wisdom.

I know FFL holders I don't think any of them send defective firearms, caused by company that manufactured them back to the distributors. Unless they would be a factory warrantee station also. But most are not.

Now if the firearm was damage in shipping or other damage that should have been noticed by the distributor they would get it back. But a defect from the company that manufactured it no. As with most every thing there could be exceptions.


Most firearms have factory seals on the boxes the distributor only look at the labels to match the order.

A function problem wouldn't be noticed 99 percent of time until the customer took it home and shot it.

It is best to put it on ignore. This site is much better that way.

 

[solus]

It is best to put it on ignore. This site is much better that way.

but then the amount of misinformation to john q public, you and to your esteemed colleagues to would lead to the proliferation of insurmountable BS you would lack the knowledge to respond to.

nice to see your invaluable contribution to the thread's content this morning...

 

[solus]

It is best to put it on ignore. This site is much better that way.

+1

but nightmare if everyone puts you on ignore, who would see your BS newspeek crap?

careful of the stones being thrown, eh?

 

[Firearms Iinstuctor]

The non-answer, answer tells me a lot.

 

[WalkingWolf]

The record sales of the SDVE series, and avalanche of positive reviews speak well for the gun. That is all that matters to me, if I had not already bought Glocks I would have rather had SD's considering the reviews. IMO a FFL that is not aware of public sentiment, and demand will go broke, and they should. Arrogance is not a well liked trait in sales, it usually results in the flipped bird, and the customer going elsewhere. Every manufacturer has a gun that slips by every so often, instead of making a fool of themselves the buyer should contact the manufacturer first before going to the internet.

As far as the thread drift, probably about time for our mod to make a suggestion.

 

[pkbites]

It is best to put it on ignore. This site is much better that way.

Yeah, I guess I got sucked into this. Never had a problem before with that user and was unaware that they had a problem with me regarding ancient history on other sites.

 

[solus]

The non-answer, answer tells me a lot.

pray tell, when you donned the FFL cloak, did you verify each unit's S/N or just accept the box's listing was correct when you entered items into your A&D?

as for your perception, as well as the OP's, regarding my response was a non-answer, then it appears you are not as perceptive as previously thought!

enjoy your perceptions, as you will.

 

[JamesCanby]

Yeah, I guess I got sucked into this. Never had a problem before with that user and was unaware that they had a problem with me regarding ancient history on other sites.

In my opinion, you must be wrong, because Solus said so, and we know that he will never let a poster get away with anything that he disagrees with, even if he has to dig into 20-year-old postings that he believes show the OP is a degenerate... whether he is or not.