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Red Robin informed me they are a "Gun Free" establishment at dinner tonight

z28power

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 4, 2014
Messages
142
Location
Las Vegas
It was a long week at work, so I decided after coming home and changing out of my work clothes that I was going to take my family to dinner. My daughter had been especially good today, I was informed, so we chose to let her pick where we would eat. As usual, she chose Red Robin. I figured I could go for a burger, so off we went. I was, per usual when not at work, Open Carrying :)

We arrived after minimal traffic and were seated at a high traffic table away from the walls. I placed myself with my back to the main line of traffic, which coincidentally placed my firearm in direct view of everybody in the kitchen. Anyway, our server came up and was friendly as ever, got some drinks and I started playing some games on the kids menu with my daughter. The store manager came up and asked how we were doing, and told me how cute my 7 month old was. Awww, thanks!

After our drinks came and the waitress took our food order back to the kitchen, another "suit" (really just collared shirt but you get it) came out and introduced himself as Andy, the Regional Manager for Red Robin. I'm thinking, "Wow, they must be doing some training, everybody is SO nice!" Boy, was I wrong. I was asked by the gentlemen if I was Law Enforcement. I smiled and looked at him and said simply, "Well, no, why would you think that?" He smiled and told me, "Well, I just wanted to let you know that Red Robin has a No Guns Policy. I know you are just here trying to enjoy the night with your family, but I wanted you to know. "

I was shocked. I have been to this exact Red Robin over 10 times Open carry, during busy and not busy times of the day. People including employees have noticed and it was never an issue. I was immediately extremely uncomfortable being confronted in this manner in the middle of the restaurant. I politely said, "Oh really? I've been here many times without issue. Is this a new policy? If I had known I would have never planned on coming here in the past or tonight." He responded, "Yes, it is company policy. It isn't posted right now but signs were being printed and notices posted for employees informing them of the policy change already."

Me (extremely perked up at hearing this is official company policy for a national chain): "Oh really, this is official company policy? Wow, that is news to me. Well, we can leave if you're saying I can't be on your property..."

Andy: "No, I just want you to know for future visits"

"Oh, there won't be future visits if this is the case..."

Andy: "I can understand that, I'm all for your right to bear arms and all that, but it's a new policy."

"Ok...." At this point I actually kinda froze. My initial first reaction was to get on immediately, tell them they can dump the beer that I had literally taken a single sip of, and cancel my order and walk out. But.. I was there with my family and my daughter was so extremely excited to have ordered her favorite Mac and cheese. So against my better judgment I decided to stay, since we weren't being asked to leave. Our waitress came over immediately and was concerned that she had done something wrong. I assured her everything was fine with her service and it was regarding another matter.

As the minutes went on, I really started to get upset. It felt like I had just been violated in front my family in the middle of a restaurant. My wife could tell I was extremely upset and reiterated multiple times we could leave. She even suggested we ask him to box up my daughter's mac and cheese and take it home so she could still get that and we could still make our statement. I brought it up to my daughter, and she looked so crestfallen. I couldn't punish her for this guy's confrontation with me if I could help it. So I pushed onward.

Our food was obviously expedited, (or I lost track of time in my many thoughts of what I should go back and say to this guy before I left). Our food came quite quickly and that made the decision to stay a bit easier. I found myself not hungry at all, though. I decided to politely motion for the regional manager again on his next pass by the table (many such "casual walks" were done by people in non-standard red robin attire, leading me to believe some sort of training or introduction of new management was occurring tonight.). I let him know that to be honest I wasn't really comfortable in the restaurant anymore after being informed they do not support the second amendment, and that if my daughter hadn't been so good today and being brought here as a fun reward for the family and her, I would have absolutely gotten up and left as I did not feel comfortable doing business there.

To his credit, the guy was really gracious. He said he appreciates my point and even apologized for his timing on talking to me about it if he wasn't planning on asking me to leave. He also comped the entire meal. I asked him if he could leave me a business card and a copy of the official company policy that was going to be posted. He told me no problem and disappeared to the back.

After finishing the meal, the waitress let me know there wasn't actually even a bill at all and we were all set to leave. After tipping her generously and letting her know again that we were completely happy with her service (she really was great.), I told her we were just waiting on a business card and some company memos from the Regional manager. He came back a few minutes later with his business card stapled to... 2 printed out images of "No Firearms signs" that I can only assume were printed out from Google images moments earlier.





Can you believe it? No company memo or letter explaining a policy change as he had stated... Just two pictures of some no firearms signs printed from the internet! He explained to me that these were just a photo of the signs that he was going to have posted at all the restaurants in the region following an incident at one of his other locations.

I handed him back an open carry card/pamphlet link I had actually turned back around when we left the house to get.. just in case. Can you believe the serendipity there? He took it and looked genuinely interested. I seized the moment and things got interesting at this point.

"I appreciate you giving me these copies. Just so you know, signs carry no weight of law in Nevada so unless you are going to trespass people they can legally still carry past a sign. Furthermore, Nevada State Preemption actually specifically states nobody except the state legislature and federal level laws can restrict where and when I can carry my firearm in Nevada. Did you know that Nevada is one of the most gun friendly states in the country?"

"NO, I actually did not know that.."

"Yup! Also, this second sign looks like something that was printed from the internet regarding Arizona state laws. That sign doesn't really do anything in Nevada nor California. It looks like probably an Arizona revised statute. Just so you know. There are Nevada Revised statutes, but they only restrict Concealed weapons in public buildings. Nevada state preemption IS a revised statute that applies to you and everybody else in the state, and that is NRS 244.364... (I did not mention the other two as I didn't remember them.) On this business card there's a URL that gives a lot of really good info about Open carrying in Nevada. There's a large community of activists I'm a part of here, so if you have any questions please email me." I handed him my business card with my contact info on it as well, and he said he would be in contact. He seemed to MAYBE have a little bit of doubt as to his decision, so I pushed it a little more. "Thanks again for the dinner, please know I'd rather come back many more times and pay for dinner with my family while armed, then get a free meal this one time. I really hope you'll reconsider the policy on a locale-specific level, as many things that are taboo in places like California, where you're from, are completely normal and OK here."

Him: "I really appreciate it and am still learning some of the state specific things, so I'm always willing to learn anything new on subjects I'm not familiar with."

Wow. I was really amazed at the end. I truly, truly hope he does reconsider, but did want to make sure that per my direct conversation with him, this is still a policy in effect as of tonight. I missed some of the bits of conversation about criminals not really paying attention to signs and I'm sure I didn't quote exactly perfectly, but most of it is extremely close to what transpired. If you want to be active, please do! I'm emailing him and a whole slew of C-level executives tonight hoping to let him know I'm serious. While he didn't reverse his decision, he did seem amicable to discussion and receptive to talking about the laws and specific markets differing in policies. Anyway, I wanted to share while it was still fresh in my mind. This is my first negative experience while OCing, and I hope I was able to represent the community decently while hopefully educating somebody that seems to be flexing some newly acquired power as a regional manager.

Sent from my Surface with Windows 8 Pro using Tapatalk
 
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Vegassteve

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Apr 15, 2008
Messages
1,763
Location
Las Vegas NV, ,
You did what you had to do. The only thing I ever take issue with is this. NEVER inform them of the sign issue. As you said they carry no weight in NV and we want to keep it that way. It only gives these idiots from other places like cali to get in on our leg sessions and try to change things. They choose to place the sign let them just think they are doing something.

And if the idiots from cali and red robin read this, well you lost a lot of biz today. Red robin used to be a carry friendly place. We now know they prefer the criminals to be armed but not the honest folks.
 

F350

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 22, 2012
Messages
942
Location
The High Plains of Wyoming
I know this is the Nevada page but; I OCed in a Red Robin today at lunch, it was slow (rain in the high desert, people here may think they will melt) and I talked guns with the manager at the bar after he saw my OC.

Most likely some young kid feeling his power.
 

z28power

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 4, 2014
Messages
142
Location
Las Vegas
I know this is the Nevada page but; I OCed in a Red Robin today at lunch, it was slow (rain in the high desert, people here may think they will melt) and I talked guns with the manager at the bar after he saw my OC.

Most likely some young kid feeling his power.
Which is exactly why I am writing to corporate management about the issue as well, my hope is this guy is retrained to comply with state and local laws, just like the rest of the corporations that toe the line to ensure that they do not alienate a large and active customer base.
 

z28power

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 4, 2014
Messages
142
Location
Las Vegas
You did what you had to do. The only thing I ever take issue with is this. NEVER inform them of the sign issue. As you said they carry no weight in NV and we want to keep it that way. It only gives these idiots from other places like cali to get in on our leg sessions and try to change things. They choose to place the sign let them just think they are doing something.

And if the idiots from cali and red robin read this, well you lost a lot of biz today. Red robin used to be a carry friendly place. We now know they prefer the criminals to be armed but not the honest folks.
I appreciate where you are coming from. It just kinda took me by surprise. He was talking about they are posting official info for employees about a policy change, and when I asked to see the corporate memo stating the change he said yes and then came back with these B&W printed images that I'm assuming came from Google images, and told me signs like this were going to be put up at each store. I just... I needed to make sure that he knew that a sign like this was not going to do any good. I'm of the opinion that I don't want them thinking that they can put up a sign and that does something, so I guess we're both on differing sides of there same end opinion, so to speak. :) I think that by making him think a sign does something, he'll feel empowered to put up a sign, which will maybe lead to another and another. Then when you start telling them the sign doesn't matter, maybe it's too late. Maybe there's enough of them that they go ahead and lobby to make signs carry weight of law here. I'd rather they just know that a sign does nothing to stop me from entering a property and state preemption specifically has my back on this. By emphasizing state preemption I hope he does go look at the info on the OC pamphlet and see that state preemption does allow me to carry wherever I please and decides it might be best to leave policies like this to the state legislature.

We're both using different means to an end, but both with the intention of ensuring that signs do NOT carry weight of law. I would never have ever told them "well.. there wasn't a sign..." or indicate signage would ever make a difference to me, I hope that impression was not given. :)
 

z28power

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Mar 4, 2014
Messages
142
Location
Las Vegas
Oh, and the position this particular person holds in the company is "Regional Operations Director." So it sounds like he does have corporate policymaking decision ability at the regional level. We will see what the future holds, but currently it does not hold any red robin burgers for me. Smashburger has never had a problem with my OC pistol, I guess we'll try there moving forward until I hear otherwise.
 

Vegassteve

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Messages
1,763
Location
Las Vegas NV, ,
I appreciate where you are coming from. It just kinda took me by surprise.
Preemption as well is not part of the pvt party issue. Preemption just applies to what local governments can do. It has zero effect on pvt biz. Sort of like the Constitution applies to our rights vs the Gov.
 

MAC702

Campaign Veteran
Joined
Jul 31, 2011
Messages
6,337
Location
Nevada
While a few imperfections have been noted, I think we all agree you did a very good job overall. It is fantastic that he was actually willing to listen, and that you were prepared to discuss it as well. Nicely done.

Maybe next week, send him a receipt from Landry's or another pro-carry restaurant, and let him know you'd have rather the business went to his store; just so he doesn't forget to reconsider once you are out of sight and out of mind.
 

MAC702

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Jul 31, 2011
Messages
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Nevada
...He explained to me that these were just a photo of the signs that he was going to have posted at all the restaurants in the region following an incident at one of his other locations....
I'd really like to hear about the details on that. Any way to get him to discuss it?
 

garand_guy

Regular Member
Joined
Feb 15, 2014
Messages
493
Location
Nevada
I'm flabbergasted by all that. I am also very suspicious that the signs were taken off Google, particularly given the Arizona (I'm assuming) sign.

It would appear that this incident was spurred on by a visitor from California who is ignorant of Nevada's law (God-willing, we'll educate some tourists tonight!) and chose to impose an ill-conceived it in a very embarrassing fashion to a man treating his family to dinner.

I fail to understand why people have a problem with Americans who want to protect themselves. When I was still a little bit of a liberal California, I thought open carry was the right thing to do; everybody could see what you had. I figured out on my own it ought to be unregulated. Seems to me this was a case of knowing instinctually things were different in Nevada, but being totally ignorant of the law and culture.

Even from a business owner's perspective, understanding the local laws and culture are important. If none of the other patrons had a problem with OC, then why make a stink about it? Why offend a customer and lose business when you don't have to? It's offending us because someone else might be offended.

The law enforcement thing bugs me too. My own reply, when I want to (usually because of the ladies :lol:) is "I'm retired," which is half-true. A totally truthful response would be "Yes sir, I do have arrest powers." Or citizen's arrest.
"Can I see your credentials?"
"Well, I'd be happy to show you my driver license."

z28power, maybe Sierra Gold has a kids menu? :uhoh:
 

FattyKrack

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 20, 2013
Messages
86
Location
Bainbridge Island, Wa
I would come with a thread calling the entire national business anti gun. I have eaten at RR in WA while OCing, no issue.
Ditto. From waterfront Seattle to Spokane no issues.
My woman's cousin just transferred to a Sparks, NV RR from WA and am going to ask her to tell me what's up!
Very well done!
 
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28kfps

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Aug 1, 2012
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Pointy end and slightly to the left
I also sent an Emil. I kept it civil, it appeared he did have some compassion for the other side. I made it as a request to reconsider and listed reasons.

They and others will say they have a right to say who can enter. I do appreciate their right as a private business. Unlike a private home, businesses spend millions on advertisement to encourage and welcoming the general public to come in and spend money. Come one, come all, come on in and spend is not the same as one would see on most private homes or properties.
We the general public expects to be allowed in like everyone else that is not breaking any laws. If they want to take advantage of their private business rights then I say they should also include a statement to their main stream advertisement, persons exercising their 2nd Amendment right not allowed.
 

cjohnson44546

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Nov 8, 2013
Messages
188
Location
Memphis, TN
2acheck removed them from their boycott list due to non-enforcement, but they do have a no-guns policy, and I still personally boycott them.

http://www.2acheck.com/red-robin-gourmet-burgers/

I sent them an email about a year ago, asking if it was their policy of no guns... I received back the same canned response posted on that link above. I then replied to that email, telling them how horrible of a policy that is, and makes the place more dangerous, and that I can no longer eat there any more, even though it used to be my #1 favorite place ever... and ate there like once or twice a week for years in different locations even when traveling.

Their response to my follow up reply? One sentence... "Thanks for taking the time to share your opinions."

That to me basically means "go away, you are not welcome and leave us alone" ... I haven't been in any since then, and missed it a lot for a month or two... but I don't anymore. I have no time to waste on a company who flat out tells me they don't want my business simply because I want to be able to defend myself if needed.
 

z28power

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 4, 2014
Messages
142
Location
Las Vegas
Thanks for all the responses. A couple things:

Firstly, my implication with preemption is that there is no power granted *by the government* TO private businesses to restrict my firearm possession. Trespassing laws are still in place and I am aware of that. I may have, in my rush to finish my novel last night, not been clear enough here. I was clear in my verbal conversation with Andy, I assure you. :)

I had no idea RR was anti 2a. I had been going to this one regularly for some time now with *0* issues until tonight. I am going to follow up in a few emails and wonder if they have it in them to take the same anti, but not really, stance sbux and target have. Probably not but I want to keep the dialog open with somebody in a corporate position like this if it can affect even a local change.

I will bring the papers and business card he gave me to the meetup tonight for all to look at and laugh about. :lol:

EMN, I'm confused on your post, perhaps there's a mistype or maybe I'm reading it wrong. Can you clarify?

MAC, I asked about the signs for a couple minutes and he was evasive and it seemed to imply there was no memo as he had originally stated, and perhaps didn't expect me to request it respectfully as I did. He only started that these would be the signs that would be going up to let the public know about the policy and so the employees all knew about it as well. Also, I have always like the sending receipts making a real financial feedback to company in a visibly negative bottom line for them and will be doing this for sure. I told my wife as much last night upon leaving.

Njkenelly, it was red robin on eastern and Silverado ranch.

I agree, if the policy won't change, my business of choice will be.
 
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garand_guy

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Feb 15, 2014
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493
Location
Nevada
I would have to say the only time signs should come up in an 'adverse' conversation would be when someone is threatening to trespass you based on the the signs.

Example:
"Hey, you are trespassing! We have signs that say no guns are allowed and you committed a criminal trespass by walking past the sign with a black gun silhouette under a big red X labeled only 'No guns'."
"In Nevada, signs do not have the force of law. If you like me to leave, I will, but by ignoring your sign, I did not commit a trespass or a crime."
 

njkennelly

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Feb 28, 2012
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76
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Las Vegas
I take my family to the RR at Centennial & Tropical OCing all the time with never an issue, even standing in the bar area picking up a to go order. One time I think I noticed a small sign high up on the wall in the hostess/waiting area but paid it no mind.
 

ed2276

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Joined
Nov 29, 2011
Messages
366
Location
Las Vegas,NV
I know this is the Nevada page but; I OCed in a Red Robin today at lunch, it was slow (rain in the high desert, people here may think they will melt) and I talked guns with the manager at the bar after he saw my OC.

Most likely some young kid feeling his power.
It may be that it is a new pollicy and hasn't been circulated through all the chains yet. Although, his printing of an Arizona statute when he's in Nevada is suspicious. Even with an actual policy, it is the local staff that have to enforce it, and some may not. The Jack in the Box policy is real, but I tested it out at my local JITB after the announcement and none of the employees asked me to leave. In fact, one of the customers, who CC, came up to me and we had a conversation about OC.
 
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