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Open Carrier killed with own gun

bomber

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http://www.gunsforeveryone.com/open-carrier-has-gun-stolen-then-murdered-with-it/


"Tyler, a customer at the BP station, was killed about 8:15 p.m. Friday, Nov. 25, inside the store. According to court papers, Smith and Hamiel arrived at the BP together on a single scooter and followed Tyler into the store.

Tyler, 48, had a concealed-carry permit, but his handgun was plainly visible that night in his holster, Johnson said.

"The suspects walk in and one immediately reached for Mr. Tyler's gun," Johnson said. Tyler did not draw his weapon."

It had to happen eventually. tragic.
 
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Polynikes

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This account is currently being discussed in two other threads on this forum.
How about instead of just posting snippy replies in all the related threads, you provide a link to the current discussion, so that people can more easily join in on the topic that you're so militantly policing. ;)
 

MilProGuy

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How about instead of just posting snippy replies in all the related threads, you provide a link to the current discussion, so that people can more easily join in on the topic that you're so militantly policing. ;)
Wasn't meant to be snippy.

Just merely stating a fact.
 

eye95

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In one of the other threads, another link was posted that implied that the carry was concealed and flat stated that the carrier chased the BG into the store.

It remains to be seen if this was an OC gun-grab.
 

cloudcroft

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bomber,

Yes, it's tragic, and it does show that situational awareness MIGHT have given the guy some warning (i.e., someone getting TOO close to you -- or maybe not since we weren't there).

But as the "other" and better-known OCers -- meaning cops -- sometimes get their guns used against them, it can happen to OCers, too, and as you say, it eventually HAD to happen. But just as true, that doesn't mean the practice of OCing a firearm (by cops or citizens) is a bad idea and should be discontinued.

The even sadder part of this, unfortunately, is that given our pathetic "Criminal Justice System" (especially for hard-core criminal "juveniles") that street-trash punk will be back on the streets (sooner than later) while the victim's life is over forever. And saddest of all, that sorry story will continue to play indefinitely, with no end in sight.

As I've said, the only "justice" criminals really see is on the scene of a crime and at the hands of an armed citizen (and sometimes cops) when the criminal is dead on the ground.

We just need to be more aware of our surroundings (and maybe reading body-language) so we also don't become casualties, too. This could have happened to any of us, I'm sure.
 
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MilProGuy

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bomber,

Yes, it's tragic, and it does show that situational awareness MIGHT have given the guy some warning (i.e., someone getting TOO close to you -- or maybe not since we weren't there)...

...We just need to be more aware of our surroundings (and maybe reading body-language) so we also don't become casualties, too.

Absolutely.

Situational awareness must be priority one in the society we now live in.
 

bomber

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How about instead of just posting snippy replies in all the related threads, you provide a link to the current discussion, so that people can more easily join in on the topic that you're so militantly policing. ;)
for real dawg
 

bomber

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In one of the other threads, another link was posted that implied that the carry was concealed and flat stated that the carrier chased the BG into the store.

It remains to be seen if this was an OC gun-grab.
the witness, Johnson, said it was OC
 

MilProGuy

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How about instead of just posting snippy replies in all the related threads, you provide a link to the current discussion, so that people can more easily join in on the topic that you're so militantly policing. ;)
Aren't you going to join in and comment on the topic?
 

bomber

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bomber,

Yes, it's tragic, and it does show that situational awareness MIGHT have given the guy some warning (i.e., someone getting TOO close to you -- or maybe not since we weren't there).

But as the "other" and better-known OCers -- meaning cops -- sometimes get their guns used against them, it can happen to OCers, too, and as you say, it eventually HAD to happen. But just as true, that doesn't mean the practice of OCing a firearm (by cops or citizens) is a bad idea and should be discontinued.

The even sadder part of this, unfortunately, is that given our pathetic "Criminal Justice System" (especially for hard-core criminal "juveniles") that street-trash punk will be back on the streets (sooner than later) while the victim's life is over forever. And saddest of all, that sorry story will continue to play indefinitely, with no end in sight.

As I've said, the only "justice" criminals really see is on the scene of a crime and at the hands of an armed citizen (and sometimes cops) when the criminal is dead on the ground.

We just need to be more aware of our surroundings (and maybe reading body-language) so we also don't become casualties, too. This could have happened to any of us, I'm sure.

cops get their guns grabbed because the bad guy almost always knows what kind of situation he is getting into when dealing with a cop. he comes to the fight knowing that he will be facing someone with a gun in a holster. knowing is half the battle.

OC'ers, on the other hand, aren't usually in situations where a bad guy is going to walk in expecting to see a dude with a gun in a holster. So it seems to me that the reason OC'ers are not targeted for gun grabs like cops are is because the criminal has not mentally prepared himself for that opportunity.

i don't think OC'ing is necessarily a bad idea, it just didn't seem to work out very well for this particular guy.
 

KBCraig

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Granite State of Mind
This incident, from what we can deduce from poorly written news articles, seems to be an indictment of open carry to just the same degree as "someone was concealed carrying on campus but crime still happened!"
 

bomber

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This incident, from what we can deduce from poorly written news articles, seems to be an indictment of open carry to just the same degree as "someone was concealed carrying on campus but crime still happened!"
that's not the way I see it, but I do see how some will take it that way.

Just because you carry doesn't mean you're always going to win
 

since9

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"Tyler, a customer at the BP station, was killed about 8:15 p.m. Friday, Nov. 25, inside the store. According to court papers, Smith and Hamiel arrived at the BP together on a single scooter and followed Tyler into the store.
This account is not consistent with the original article, which states: "Toby Smith Jr. is accused of stealing Blaine Tyler's gun inside a gas station last week and fatally shooting him after Tyler chased Smith inside the store."

Your account said they perps followed Tyler (the victim) into the store. The Richmond-Times Dispatch says Tyler (the victim) chased the perps into the store.

Which is it? I later read your account towards the end of the article, so the article itself is internally inconsistent, particularly as it also says, "The court records were filed this week as part of the discovery process for the current cases against Smith and Hamiel. The documents do not list sentencing information or details about the crimes."

So, is the reporter making half of it up as they go along? Did their editor fall asleep?

Bottom line: "Smith faces 17 charges, including two counts of murder in the deaths of Tyler and Cosby, along with robbery of Tyler and two counts of attempted robbery in the Edwards Avenue slaying. Hamiel faces eight charges, including murder and robbery of Tyler."

Time to let 'em fry.
 
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