Last Night - Attempted Home Invasion at My House

[HankT]

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Carnivore wrote:

HankT wrote:

Carnivore wrote:

I would feel like his alcohol caused himyet another big problem ..

That's all you would feel? Nothing else? Wouldn't you feel something else if you shot the drunk and/or killed him?

It'd be bout like when I walk up on a Deer, I'd check the point of impact/bullet placement.

How do you know it would be like when you walk up on a deer?

 

[Carnivore]

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God sent that drunk to the wrong door for a reason, just happens to turn out that the fella needs to realize he has a Guardian Angel working overtime to keep him alive The Good Lord looks out for fools and Drunks, just so happens that some folks have double indemnity

 

[HankT]

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Carnivore wrote:

God sent that drunk to the wrong door for a reason, just happens to turn out that the fella needs to realize he has a Guardian Angel working overtime to keep him alive The Good Lord looks out for fools and Drunks, just so happens that some folks have double indemnity

How do you know it would be like when you walk up on a deer?

 

[Carnivore]

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It wouldn't be anything at all like walking up on a downed deer, I said I'd check my shot placement like I would when I shoot a deer, but cry/shit my pants/freak out and scream OH GOD what have I done? NOT!! thats just fate man. we all carry it with us from the moment we're born, and everyday when our feet hit the ground, that fella was and is a very lucky man..

But I'd bet you a dollar to a donut, that isn't the only problem that man has had with Alcohol in his life..

 

[nobucks]

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I'd prefer to think that my guardian angel was working overtime, holding the door so I didn't have to kill him. I hope that he knows how close he came, and that he'll straighten out after it, but somehow, I doubt it.

Taking a human life is not something to be treated lightly. Like Eastwood says, "You take away all he's got, and all he's ever gonna have."

For anyone who carries a firearm, or any lethal weapon, for that matter, the possibility of killing someone is something that you'd better get your head around before you have to do it. First make up your mind whether or not you can take a life, and if you decide that you can't, you should put the gun away, because when the need arises, you're going to hesitate, or shoot to wound, or some other dumb thing and it may not turn out very well for you.

I made the decision a lot of years ago, that if it comes to the need for deadly force, I will willingly shoot to stop the threat, and the rest is up to God and the paramedics (to quote Dr. Grossman).

I would not have been happy that the drunk guy forfeited his life in my house. I would not have been happy that I had ended his life. It would have been a tragedy for him and his family.

I would have been happy that no violence came to my family members. I'm sure I would have felt remorse, as that's a natural reaction. But I would have felt relief as well, that it was him and not me or one of mine. When the need arises again, I will willingly step into the breach.

On Combat, by Col. Grossman, should be required reading for anyone who carries a gun. He'll help you answer your own questions, as well as explain to you what you'll feel after the fact, and why.

Again, that guy was within 60 seconds of losing his life, but I'm not losing sleep over it.

 

[MSC 45ACP]

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nobucks wrote:

I'd prefer to think that my guardian angel was working overtime, holding the door so I didn't have to kill him. I hope that he knows how close he came, and that he'll straighten out after it, but somehow, I doubt it.

Taking a human life is not something to be treated lightly. Like Eastwood says, "You take away all he's got, and all he's ever gonna have."

For anyone who carries a firearm, or any lethal weapon, for that matter, the possibility of killing someone is something that you'd better get your head around before you have to do it. First make up your mind whether or not you can take a life, and if you decide that you can't, you should put the gun away, because when the need arises, you're going to hesitate, or shoot to wound, or some other dumb thing and it may not turn out very well for you.

I made the decision a lot of years ago, that if it comes to the need for deadly force, I will willingly shoot to stop the threat, and the rest is up to God and the paramedics (to quote Dr. Grossman).

I would not have been happy that the drunk guy forfeited his life in my house. I would not have been happy that I had ended his life. It would have been a tragedy for him and his family.

I would have been happy that no violence came to my family members. I'm sure I would have felt remorse, as that's a natural reaction. But I would have felt relief as well, that it was him and not me or one of mine. When the need arises again, I will willingly step into the breach.

On Combat, by Col. Grossman, should be required reading for anyone who carries a gun. He'll help you answer your own questions, as well as explain to you what you'll feel after the fact, and why.

Again, that guy was within 60 seconds of losing his life, but I'm not losing sleep over it.

You made the correct decision and you are not losing sleep over it because of it. If the door had failed and you had shot him, you'd be losing sleep over it. Trust me on that one. If you ever have to pull the trigger, it changes your life. Forever. I'm glad you didn't have to make the decision. You did the right thing. Hopefully, someone will tell the drunk how close he came to not having a hangover the next day, or ever again.

 

[TechnoWeenie]

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nobucks wrote:

Taking a human life is not something to be treated lightly. 

It's not, but sometimes it's just 'shit needs be doin'

You gotta do what you gotta do...


When you remember that you shoot to stop the threat, and not shoot to kill, there are no regrets.

It's either you or him(her)...

 

[MSC 45ACP]

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TechnoWeenie wrote:

nobucks wrote:

Taking a human life is not something to be treated lightly.

It's not, but sometimes it's just '@#$% needs be doin'

You gotta do what you gotta do...


When you remember that you shoot to stop the threat, and not shoot to kill, there are no regrets.

It's either you or him(her)...

IF you have to pull the trigger, there are always regrets. You know you did the right thing, but you ALSO wonder if it could have been any different. Could you have done ANYTHING differently so that you didn't have to do what needed doing.

I guess you've never had to pull the trigger on anything but a target or a 4-legged animal... There are always regrets and you always lose sleep over it. You eventually get over it, but you will ALWAYS remember it.

 

[TechnoWeenie]

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MSC 45ACP wrote:

TechnoWeenie wrote:

nobucks wrote:

Taking a human life is not something to be treated lightly. 

It's not, but sometimes it's just '@#$% needs be doin'

You gotta do what you gotta do...


When you remember that you shoot to stop the threat, and not shoot to kill, there are no regrets.

It's either you or him(her)...

IF you have to pull the trigger, there are always regrets.  You know you did the right thing, but you ALSO wonder if it could have been any different.  Could you have done ANYTHING differently so that you didn't have to do what needed doing.

I guess you've never had to pull the trigger on anything but a target or a 4-legged animal...  There are always regrets and you always lose sleep over it.  You eventually get over it, but you will ALWAYS remember it.

Call me cold hearted, but if it ever comes to that (and let's hope not, of course), it's the OTHER persons fault he put himself in a position where I have no other choice but to shoot...

Ironically enough, I had a dream the other night that my brother was completely drunk, really pissed off, and shot a pistol at me... He didn't drop it, and I shot him... I wasn't mad at myself. I DID second guess it for a second, but it quickly turned into me being pissed at my brother for not giving me an alternative. In the dream, I was mourning the loss of my brother, as any normal person would, but I was not questioning my actions, as I had no other choice at the time...


So, as I said..

Shitty situation, yes.

As long as you're on morally sound ground, F 'em...

 

[HankT]

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TechnoWeenie wrote:

MSC 45ACP wrote:

IF you have to pull the trigger, there are always regrets. You know you did the right thing, but you ALSO wonder if it could have been any different. Could you have done ANYTHING differently so that you didn't have to do what needed doing.

I guess you've never had to pull the trigger on anything but a target or a 4-legged animal... There are always regrets and you always lose sleep over it. You eventually get over it, but you will ALWAYS remember it.

Call me cold hearted, but if it ever comes to that (and let's hope not, of course), it's the OTHER persons fault he put himself in a position where I have no other choice but to shoot...

You're cold-hearted.And you displaya persistent naïveté.





TechnoWeenie wrote:

As long as you're on morally sound ground, F 'em...

Yeah.....F'em...F'em good.....yeah....got it....

 

[Bikenut]

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First of all a civilian never intends to end a life... the entire concept is abhorrent to decent people.

Secondly decent people will, and even should, and often must, do what ever is necessary to protect their own life and the lives of others.

Decent people, when protecting themselves and others, will only do as much as is necessary to stop the threat. When the threat stops a decent person stops responding to that threat. If death occurs because of those actions it is regrettable ... and horribly tragic.

The thing is... decent people, because they are decent people, will be comfortable with the decision taken to defend but, again because they are decent people, will be shaken to the core to have been put into the position to have ended a human life.

Decent people understand that even the most evil hard core criminal......... is still a fellow human being. And that is the part that will sadden a decent person for a very long time... perhaps forever.

However, even decent people WILL do what is necessary at the time it is necessary.... and second guess themselves with sadness at leisure. Perhaps for the rest of their lives.

I have not ended any human lives nor do I wish to. The concept is abhorrent to me.... yet personal experience has already shown that I will do what is necessary at the time it is necessary. And that I will second guess my decisions/actions for the rest of my life.

 

[HankT]

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MSC 45ACP wrote:

IF you have to pull the trigger, there are always regrets. You know you did the right thing, but you ALSO wonder if it could have been any different. Could you have done ANYTHING differently so that you didn't have to do what needed doing.

I guess you've never had to pull the trigger on anything but a target or a 4-legged animal... There are always regrets and you always lose sleep over it. You eventually get over it, but you will ALWAYS remember it.

You understand, MSC 45ACP.

Here's a thread that may help others to understand.

http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/forum60/3861-1.html

 

[Carnivore]

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I was in a position of getting ready to blow a fellas eyebrows one time, all he needed to do is act on what he was telling me he intended to do by reaching inside my vehicle and grabbing me, it woulda been lights out, and one bloody headliner in my grand cherokee! and I would've probably missed work that night, but not any sleep.

 

[HankT]

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Carnivore wrote:

I was in a position of getting ready to blow a fellas eyebrows one time, all he needed to do is act on what he was telling me he intended to do by reaching inside my vehicle and grabbing me, it woulda been lights out, and one bloody headliner in my grand cherokee! and I would've probably missed work that night, but not any sleep.

Do you know what happens to your ears when you fire a handgun in a vechicle?



What happened in your eyebrows incident?

 

[Carnivore]

imported post

Oh yeah I'm fully aware of what to expect from a muzzle blast from within a vehicle.. My ears are already shot, and the glass is replacable.



A friend of mine and his son were smallmouth fishing a river not far from me, and when they returned to their vehicle at sunset, my friend decided he would sit around a camp with 3 fellas that were camped on the gravelbar near the parking place.

His son called me just minutes before i was leaving for work on midnight shift and told me that he needed my help. I said sure Bubs what ya need, he proceeded to tell me how the evening unfolded to the point of his Dad getting drunk on whiskey with these 3 new aquaintances, and when the boy suggested cmon dad we better be getting home, I'll drive !

well one of the adult men took the boy off to the side and told him you ain't going nowhere, your ole man is partying with us.. unbeknownst to the kids dad, since he was totally intoxicated, the other fella commenced to whoopin the boys ass.

Move forward in time, while someone was keeping my drunk buddy occupied, another fella was over at the parking lot cleaning out my buddies truck.

Well the boywalked a long ways to the hiway and called me on his cell and I told him I'll be right there.

When I arrived and picked up the son, we went down to the river and there was his dad sitting on the ground beside his truck and a fella sitting inside the cab of my buddies truck rummaging around like he was looking in the floorboard on the pass. side. I pulled up beside the truck, and the fella inside the truck told me to leave, it's a private party. I told him I was here to pick up my friend and wasn't leaving without him, he steeped out of my friends truck and pointed out toward the hiway and said you will get the F--- out of here if I tell you to, I replied not until I get my friend in my jeep, so I told the son to go over and get his dad up and help him to my passenger side seat.

Evidently there was more in the truck that those fellas wanted to get their hands on, because this loudmouth tottood from the top of his skull to his beltline stepped right beside my door and said he'd f------ rip my throat out if I didn't leave, I warned him, DO NOT PUT ONE HAND INSIDE MY VEHICLE, this I'll rip your head off/you're a F------ Pus-- if you don't get out of your jeep right now went on for about 10 minutes or so right in my face at the drivers door and I repeated several times DO not put your hand inside my vehicle.. while the son was coaxing his father to the passenger side of my vehicle.

When the boy opened the pass. door to get ready for his dad to enter this Loudmouth leaned in across the passenger seat, and I met him right over the seat w/ a .44mag just an inch or so from his nose, he promptly leaned right back out of the vehicle, and told his buddies that we're now blocking the back of my vehicle to hurry up and get this fella in the jeep so he can get home.. The 9mm was in the seat between my legs, and the .44 mag was slid down between the seat and console the whole time until the loudmouth leaned into the passenger side. Then I made a believer out of him and all went smooth upon my exit drive out,, the fellas had been ramming their jeep brushguard on every corner of my friends truck, So theson was justified in being in fear for his dads safety, and I've known the Dad since we were kids, and the boy since he was born, and the kid is 19 now and I've always told him Bubs if you're in the right, and you need help, you can call me 24/7/365

 

[HankT]

imported post

Carnivore wrote:

HankT wrote:

Carnivore wrote:

I was in a position of getting ready to blow a fellas eyebrows one time, all he needed to do is act on what he was telling me he intended to do by reaching inside my vehicle and grabbing me, it woulda been lights out, and one bloody headliner in my grand cherokee! and I would've probably missed work that night, but not any sleep.

What happened in your eyebrows incident?

A friend of mine and his son were smallmouth fishing a river not far from me, and when they returned to their vehicle at sunset, my friend decided he would sit around a camp with 3 fellas that were camped on the gravelbar near the parking place.

His son called me just minutes before i was leaving for work on midnight shift and told me that he needed my help. I said sure Bubs what ya need, he proceeded to tell me how the evening unfolded to the point of his Dad getting drunk on whiskey with these 3 new aquaintances, and when the boy suggested cmon dad we better be getting home, I'll drive !

well one of the adult men took the boy off to the side and told him you ain't going nowhere, your ole man is partying with us.. unbeknownst to the kids dad, since he was totally intoxicated, the other fella commenced to whoopin the boys ass.

Move forward in time, while someone was keeping my drunk buddy occupied, another fella was over at the parking lot cleaning out my buddies truck.

Well the boywalked a long ways to the hiway and called me on his cell and I told him I'll be right there.

When I arrived and picked up the son, we went down to the river and there was his dad sitting on the ground beside his truck and a fella sitting inside the cab of my buddies truck rummaging around like he was looking in the floorboard on the pass. side. I pulled up beside the truck, and the fella inside the truck told me to leave, it's a private party. I told him I was here to pick up my friend and wasn't leaving without him, he steeped out of my friends truck and pointed out toward the hiway and said you will get the F--- out of here if I tell you to, I replied not until I get my friend in my jeep, so I told the son to go over and get his dad up and help him to my passenger side seat.

Evidently there was more in the truck that those fellas wanted to get their hands on, because this loudmouth tottood from the top of his skull to his beltline stepped right beside my door and said he'd f------ rip my throat out if I didn't leave, I warned him, DO NOT PUT ONE HAND INSIDE MY VEHICLE, this I'll rip your head off/you're a F------ Pus-- if you don't get out of your jeep right now went on for about 10 minutes or so right in my face at the drivers door and I repeated several times DO not put your hand inside my vehicle.. while the son was coaxing his father to the passenger side of my vehicle.

When the boy opened the pass. door to get ready for his dad to enter this Loudmouth leaned in across the passenger seat, and I met him right over the seat w/ a .44mag just an inch or so from his nose, he promptly leaned right back out of the vehicle, and told his buddies that we're now blocking the back of my vehicle to hurry up and get this fella in the jeep so he can get home.. The 9mm was in the seat between my legs, and the .44 mag was slid down between the seat and console the whole time until the loudmouth leaned into the passenger side. Then I made a believer out of him and all went smooth upon my exit drive out,, the fellas had been ramming their jeep brushguard on every corner of my friends truck, So theson was justified in being in fear for his dads safety, and I've known the Dad since we were kids, and the boy since he was born, and the kid is 19 now and I've always told him Bubs if you're in the right, and you need help, you can call me 24/7/365

What a mess!

Sounds like you mis-handled your part of it, though.

But nice of you to pass on the impromptu execution opportunity (IEO).

Fortunately, yougot away with it your clumsy attempt at wannabe cop.

 

[Carnivore]

imported post

HankT wrote:

Carnivore wrote:

HankT wrote:

Carnivore wrote:

I was in a position of getting ready to blow a fellas eyebrows one time, all he needed to do is act on what he was telling me he intended to do by reaching inside my vehicle and grabbing me, it woulda been lights out, and one bloody headliner in my grand cherokee! and I would've probably missed work that night, but not any sleep.

What happened in your eyebrows incident?

A friend of mine and his son were smallmouth fishing a river not far from me, and when they returned to their vehicle at sunset, my friend decided he would sit around a camp with 3 fellas that were camped on the gravelbar near the parking place.

His son called me just minutes before i was leaving for work on midnight shift and told me that he needed my help. I said sure Bubs what ya need, he proceeded to tell me how the evening unfolded to the point of his Dad getting drunk on whiskey with these 3 new aquaintances, and when the boy suggested cmon dad we better be getting home, I'll drive !

well one of the adult men took the boy off to the side and told him you ain't going nowhere, your ole man is partying with us.. unbeknownst to the kids dad, since he was totally intoxicated, the other fella commenced to whoopin the boys ass.

Move forward in time, while someone was keeping my drunk buddy occupied, another fella was over at the parking lot cleaning out my buddies truck.

Well the boywalked a long ways to the hiway and called me on his cell and I told him I'll be right there.

When I arrived and picked up the son, we went down to the river and there was his dad sitting on the ground beside his truck and a fella sitting inside the cab of my buddies truck rummaging around like he was looking in the floorboard on the pass. side. I pulled up beside the truck, and the fella inside the truck told me to leave, it's a private party. I told him I was here to pick up my friend and wasn't leaving without him, he steeped out of my friends truck and pointed out toward the hiway and said you will get the F--- out of here if I tell you to, I replied not until I get my friend in my jeep, so I told the son to go over and get his dad up and help him to my passenger side seat.

Evidently there was more in the truck that those fellas wanted to get their hands on, because this loudmouth tottood from the top of his skull to his beltline stepped right beside my door and said he'd f------ rip my throat out if I didn't leave, I warned him, DO NOT PUT ONE HAND INSIDE MY VEHICLE, this I'll rip your head off/you're a F------ Pus-- if you don't get out of your jeep right now went on for about 10 minutes or so right in my face at the drivers door and I repeated several times DO not put your hand inside my vehicle.. while the son was coaxing his father to the passenger side of my vehicle.

When the boy opened the pass. door to get ready for his dad to enter this Loudmouth leaned in across the passenger seat, and I met him right over the seat w/ a .44mag just an inch or so from his nose, he promptly leaned right back out of the vehicle, and told his buddies that we're now blocking the back of my vehicle to hurry up and get this fella in the jeep so he can get home.. The 9mm was in the seat between my legs, and the .44 mag was slid down between the seat and console the whole time until the loudmouth leaned into the passenger side. Then I made a believer out of him and all went smooth upon my exit drive out,, the fellas had been ramming their jeep brushguard on every corner of my friends truck, So theson was justified in being in fear for his dads safety, and I've known the Dad since we were kids, and the boy since he was born, and the kid is 19 now and I've always told him Bubs if you're in the right, and you need help, you can call me 24/7/365

What a mess!

Sounds like you mis-handled your part of it, though.

But nice of you to pass on the impromptu execution opportunity (IEO).

Fortunately, yougot away with it your clumsy attempt at wannabe cop.

You threaten me in the manner this fella did, and reach inside my vehicle to grab hold of me, and you'll see how clumsy I am.. I handled myself very well, my buddy traced his stolen cell the next day and contacted the methheads and recieved all that was removed from his truck back 2 days later.

In MooseCock Missouri things have a way of getting taken care of because we look out for our own !



wanna be judge! Maybe you owe it to yourself to read up on the Missouri Castle Doctrine and you won't be so quick to judge me wrong, Go ahead educate yourself!

 

[HankT]

imported post

Carnivore wrote:

You threaten me in the manner this fella did, and reach inside my vehicle to grab hold of me, and you'll see how clumsy I am..

Huh? I don't want to go up to your vehicle and talk to you. Or reach into your car. What the hell are you talking about?

Hey, wake up! It's over. The incident happened a long time ago! I am not in your gun-fu day dream, Carnivore!

Carnivore wrote:

I handled myself very well, my buddy traced his stolen cell the next day and contacted the methheads and recieved all that was removed from his truck back 2 days later.

In MooseCock Missouri things have a way of getting taken care of because we look out for our own !

wanna be judge! Maybe you owe it to yourself to read up on the Missouri Castle Doctrine and you won't be so quick to judge me wrong, Go ahead educate yourself!

Yeah, sure, dude. You convince me. You "have a way of getting taken care of business" over dere in MooseCock Missouri.

Have fun, Carnivore.

 

[Carnivore]

imported post

Game Over little Stylez!!

 

[TechnoWeenie]

imported post

HankT wrote:

TechnoWeenie wrote:

MSC 45ACP wrote:

IF you have to pull the trigger, there are always regrets.  You know you did the right thing, but you ALSO wonder if it could have been any different.  Could you have done ANYTHING differently so that you didn't have to do what needed doing.

I guess you've never had to pull the trigger on anything but a target or a 4-legged animal...  There are always regrets and you always lose sleep over it.  You eventually get over it, but you will ALWAYS remember it.

Call me cold hearted, but if it ever comes to that (and let's hope not, of course), it's the OTHER persons fault he put himself in a position where I have no other choice but to shoot...

You're cold-hearted.   And you display a persistent naïveté.



 

TechnoWeenie wrote:

As long as you're on morally sound ground, F 'em...

Yeah.....F'em...F'em good.....yeah....got it....

 

It's called survivors guilt ...

'why me, what could I have done differently?'

Pardon me for not questioning my survival.