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Kansas - Gold Star College Carry July 1st, 2017

Grapeshot

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Kanas is the first state in the union to authorize Constitutional carry on all state colleges for 21 & above

July 1st please update map
It's a good day to be a college student in Kansas! Constitutional Carry on all college campuses begins today!
No sir that is not Constitutional Carry which would be concealed or open carry. This law with certain limitations only addresses concealed carry.

Normally we only use fair use quotes, but there are only 2 paragraph that read:

Beginning July 1, 2017, any individual 21 years or older who is otherwise legally allowed to possess a concealed handgun may do so in any public facility, or on any public grounds unless proper security measures are in place. Kansas does not require a permit to carry a concealed firearm.


‘‘Adequate security measures’’ means the use of electronic equipment and personnel at public entrances to detect and restrict the carrying of any weapons into the state or municipal building, including, but not limited to, metal detectors, metal detector wands or any other equipment used for similar purposes to ensure that weapons are not permitted to be carried into such building by members of the public. Adequate security measures for storing and securing lawfully carried weapons, including, but not limited to, the use of gun lockers or other similar storage options may be provided at public entrances.

http://www.armedcampuses.org/kansas/

Please cite where college/universities must allow open carry within the buildings.
 
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color of law

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Sure doesn't look like constitutional carry to me.

To me constitutional carry is: you can carry ANYWHERE in the state. I would be willing to concede court houses and jails, but they shall provide accommodations to secure your firearm, and private property NOT open to the public meaning your home and land. A business open to the public like stores and restaurants are not exempt.
 

JoeSparky

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No sir that is not Constitutional Carry which would be concealed or open carry. This law with certain limitations only addresses concealed carry.

Normally we only use fair use quotes, but there are only 2 paragraph that read:

Beginning July 1, 2017, any individual 21 years or older who is otherwise legally allowed to possess a concealed handgun may do so in any public facility, or on any public grounds unless proper security measures are in place. Kansas does not require a permit to carry a concealed firearm.


‘‘Adequate security measures’’ means the use of electronic equipment and personnel at public entrances to detect and restrict the carrying of any weapons into the state or municipal building, including, but not limited to, metal detectors, metal detector wands or any other equipment used for similar purposes to ensure that weapons are not permitted to be carried into such building by members of the public. Adequate security measures for storing and securing lawfully carried weapons, including, but not limited to, the use of gun lockers or other similar storage options may be provided at public entrances.

http://www.armedcampuses.org/kansas/

Please cite where college/universities must allow open carry within the buildings.
I do like the underlined and bolded last sentence of the first paragraph you posted! I did add the underling and bolding on that portion ONLY in your posting.

Is the first paragraph beginning with "Beginninng July" a quote? Since it wasn't in quotes I am not sure>

And since I have now gone to the link you provided it seems to be an article, shorth though it may be, that is simple someones interpretation of the law---- Do we have a link to the actual law to see what it actually stipulates?
 
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color of law

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http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2017/jul/1/kansas-college-campuses-brace-for-concealed-guns-u/

http://www.kansascity.com/news/politics-government/article159193599.html

Students 21 and older can carry a concealed handgun on Kansas university campuses starting Saturday. The law was originally passed in 2013, but universities had been exempt for four years to prepare.
75-7c20
(j) The governing body or the chief administrative officer, if no governing body exists, of any of the following institutions may exempt any building of such institution, or any public area thereof, from this section until July 1, 2017, by stating the reasons for such exemption and sending notice of such exemption to the Kansas attorney general:
..........
(5) a postsecondary educational institution, as defined in K.S.A. 74-3201b, and amendments thereto, including any buildings located on the grounds of such institution and any buildings leased by such institution.
http://ksrevisor.org/statutes/chapters/ch75/075_007c_0020.html
 
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gutshot II

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Central Ky.
'
Sure doesn't look like constitutional carry to me.

To me constitutional carry is: you can carry ANYWHERE in the state. I would be willing to concede court houses and jails, but they shall provide accommodations to secure your firearm, and private property NOT open to the public meaning your home and land. A business open to the public like stores and restaurants are not exempt.

I am back and such frivolous comments will no longer go unchallenged! Things have gotten very lax in my absence. I am well rested and I intend to staighten out all of the shallow thinking and point out all of the errors made by the rest of you, from now on.

Could you tell me just exactly where such a situation as you describe exists today? I don't know of a place where it exists and doubt that it will exist anywhere in the near future. If this is the only definition of "constitutional carry" that you will accept, what terms should we use to denote all of the myriad schemes that exist today and will exist in the future? Those schemes would include concealed and open carry without any certification by the state, but have some restrictions as to place, age and legal status. Will your definition allow for people that are prohibited from gun ownership to carry a gun, anyway? What age restrictions will you accept in your definition? Will you insist upon "almost constitutional carry" or "sort of constitutional carry" to discribe the existing plans? What about "semi constitutional carry" or 'faux constitutional carry or "quasi constitutional carry"? Will each different plan have to have a different name to describe each difference and accomodate each state? I try not to be hung up on the name. If it enhances my right to carry, reduces the number of places where I can't carry and is politically possible, I am for it. If it is perfect, solves all of my problems and is politically impossible, I can't get excited about it. Of course the long term goal can be as lofty as you want, but we all need to realise that progress is incremental and, perhaps none of us will live long enough see that come to fruition. I certainly will not.
 

color of law

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'


I am back and such frivolous comments will no longer go unchallenged! Things have gotten very lax in my absence. I am well rested and I intend to staighten out all of the shallow thinking and point out all of the errors made by the rest of you, from now on.

Could you tell me just exactly where such a situation as you describe exists today? I don't know of a place where it exists and doubt that it will exist anywhere in the near future. If this is the only definition of "constitutional carry" that you will accept, what terms should we use to denote all of the myriad schemes that exist today and will exist in the future? Those schemes would include concealed and open carry without any certification by the state, but have some restrictions as to place, age and legal status. Will your definition allow for people that are prohibited from gun ownership to carry a gun, anyway? What age restrictions will you accept in your definition? Will you insist upon "almost constitutional carry" or "sort of constitutional carry" to discribe the existing plans? What about "semi constitutional carry" or 'faux constitutional carry or "quasi constitutional carry"? Will each different plan have to have a different name to describe each difference and accomodate each state? I try not to be hung up on the name. If it enhances my right to carry, reduces the number of places where I can't carry and is politically possible, I am for it. If it is perfect, solves all of my problems and is politically impossible, I can't get excited about it. Of course the long term goal can be as lofty as you want, but we all need to realise that progress is incremental and, perhaps none of us will live long enough see that come to fruition. I certainly will not.
After being gone for awhile you sure have gotten a little testy. Then converting from senior citizen type to fine print makes it harder to read your grumpiness. My question is, does "gutshot I" have a friendlier personality? Or how about just getting the original gutshot back. Inquiring minds want to know......
 

gutshot II

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Messages
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Location
Central Ky.
After being gone for awhile you sure have gotten a little testy. Then converting from senior citizen type to fine print makes it harder to read your grumpiness. My question is, does "gutshot I" have a friendlier personality? Or how about just getting the original gutshot back. Inquiring minds want to know......
I am now well rested and gentle as a kitten. Thanks to all that showed such deep concern for my well being while I was absent. The full, complete and verified story and disposition of the "gutshot" persona can be found at post #23 here:
http://forum.opencarry.org/forums/showthread.php?135354-What-happened-to-gutshot-is-he-gone-and-why&p=2219436#post2219436
 

utbagpiper

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Utah
'

Could you tell me just exactly where such a situation as you describe exists today? I don't know of a place where it exists and doubt that it will exist anywhere in the near future. If this is the only definition of "constitutional carry" that you will accept, what terms should we use to denote all of the myriad schemes that exist today and will exist in the future? Those schemes would include concealed and open carry without any certification by the state, but have some restrictions as to place, age and legal status. Will your definition allow for people that are prohibited from gun ownership to carry a gun, anyway? What age restrictions will you accept in your definition? Will you insist upon "almost constitutional carry" or "sort of constitutional carry" to discribe the existing plans? What about "semi constitutional carry" or 'faux constitutional carry or "quasi constitutional carry"? Will each different plan have to have a different name to describe each difference and accomodate each state? I try not to be hung up on the name. If it enhances my right to carry, reduces the number of places where I can't carry and is politically possible, I am for it. If it is perfect, solves all of my problems and is politically impossible, I can't get excited about it. Of course the long term goal can be as lofty as you want, but we all need to realise that progress is incremental and, perhaps none of us will live long enough see that come to fruition. I certainly will not.
+1.

"Constitutional Carry" is a perfectly reasonable nomenclature for "permit-free carry" and it is a lot harder for our opponents to attack that is "permit free" or "unregulated" or any other such term that might be more technically accurate.

"Scary looking gun" is not a technical term at all. But I much prefer to talk about the "scary looking gun ban" than I do the "semi-auto pistol grip ban" or the "assault rifle ban". Likewise, I prefer "non-discriminatory permits" rather than "shall issue" or "non discretionary".

Our opponents are masters at turning a phrase to win the debate before it even starts. We must do better than we have previously done.

As one who is so often castigated for being verbose, I recognize the tremendous value of extreme brevity in terms of political talking points.

I am also a strong advocate of incrementalism: one small step forward is still a step forward as long as we don't give anything up. Enough small steps forward results in significant gains. We can see this across most States the last 30 years, even the last 20 or 10 years.

Charles
 

utbagpiper

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No sir that is not Constitutional Carry which would be concealed or open carry. This law with certain limitations only addresses concealed carry.
I contend that any law removing the requirement to obtain government permission before carrying a gun in public is fairly called "constitutional carry". That we can't carry in any manner we like, or into every location we like doesn't diminish the significant gain that it is to be legally able to carry a concealed firearm, sans permit, into an area that has been considered "sensitive" and off limits to guns for quite some time.

Having admitted that the gun carriers are on campus, they won't be able to keep us in the closet forever.

Besides, with open carry being more frequently legal without a permit than is concealed carry, the term "constitutional carry" has been used most often in recent political efforts to refer to concealed carry without a permit.
 

Grapeshot

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I contend that any law removing the requirement to obtain government permission before carrying a gun in public is fairly called "constitutional carry". That we can't carry in any manner we like, or into every location we like doesn't diminish the significant gain that it is to be legally able to carry a concealed firearm, sans permit, into an area that has been considered "sensitive" and off limits to guns for quite some time.

Having admitted that the gun carriers are on campus, they won't be able to keep us in the closet forever.

Besides, with open carry being more frequently legal without a permit than is concealed carry Reply With Quote, the term "constitutional carry" has been used most often in recent political efforts to refer to concealed carry without a permit.
Cannot agree. We have CC and OC separately and distinguishable with and w/o a permit/license.

Constitutional Carry allows the individual to carry either CC or OC entirely at their option.

How about freedom to choose? It is the right thing to do. :)
 
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marine0300

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Nov 14, 2008
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Topeka, Kansas, USA
Gold Star State College

Hi Grapeshot!

Thank you for your posts. I appreciate your insight. Can you help Kanas by making our state Gold under College maps? We do qualify for that one.
As always Kansas appreciates opencarry.org!!

have a great 4th of July

Mairine0300
 

Grapeshot

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Hi Grapeshot!

Thank you for your posts. I appreciate your insight. Can you help Kanas by making our state Gold under College maps? We do qualify for that one.
As always Kansas appreciates opencarry.org!!

have a great 4th of July

Mairine0300
Wish that I could, but editing/changing that information is not within my province.
 

utbagpiper

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Cannot agree. We have CC and OC separately and distinguishable with and w/o a permit/license.

Constitutional Carry allows the individual to carry either CC or OC entirely at their option.

How about freedom to choose? It is the right thing to do. :)
Oh, make no mistake, I fully support the full and unfettered individual RIGHT to keep AND BEAR arms. The only limitation I place on the right to bear is that it be done in a safe and peaceful manner. Make me king for a day and there will no permits needed anywhere the US Flag flies. Off limit locations will be limited to a few very rare locations with real security: jails, prisons, secure mental hospitals, and court rooms. All will be required to provide storage for legally armed visitors. Notably, commercial aircraft will NOT be off limits to private citizens carrying guns. Nobody convicted of a violent crime will be released from prison until he can be trusted to exercise his rights and once released his rights will be respected. Full auto, silences, short barreled rifles and shotguns, and so on and so forth will all be legal without any paperwork needed. Indeed, all gun sales will be free not only from all government registration and prior restraint, but also free from all sales taxes under the theory that the power to tax is the power to destroy and we do not tax fundamental rights. We'll need to figure out some other way to fund all those great things federal and local governments are doing with the sales tax on our guns, ammo, and accessories. Basic firearm safety will be required in all public grade schools, and basic firearm marksmanship and maintenance required in Junior High and High School. It will replace a PE credit as familiarity with firearms is far more important to the national defense than is football, soccer, or volleyball.

If you and I have any disagreements on the actual RKBA it is most likely because I would go farther than you (or least what most others) would go in terms of what RKBA covers.

My only disagreement with you is on the nomenclature of what we ought to be able to classify as "constitutional carry" in our current political struggles. And I contend that inasmuch as OC has enjoyed much broader legal acceptance than has CC, that "Constitutional Carry" has been employed largely in terms of getting CC onto equal legal footing with OC, namely, dropping the legal requirement for a permission slip. That whole "freedom to choose" thing applies to 1st amendment rights to label political proposals as much as it does to RKBA, no? :wink:

I also like the nomenclature of "freedom to carry" as the next rational step after "right to carry". We all know that rights are not subject to licensing and taxes. But "right to carry" served us very well in terms of moving from elite, discriminatory permits to shall issue or non discriminatory permits that have greatly increased public safety and increased our numbers to now move to the next phase. Whether that is "Freedom to Carry", "Constitutional Carry", "Permit Free Carry", or whatever else really matters only in terms of what helps good legislation pass.

We all know what the desired end goal is re RKBA.

We need not to get too hung up on what nomenclature we use to get that. Whatever honest labeling will help advance us to the next step is good nomenclature. Just like both OC, CC, and CCC are all good ways to carry a gun for self defense. Personal choice and all that.

Charles
 

Grapeshot

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--snipped--

We need not to get too hung up on what nomenclature we use to get that. Whatever honest labeling will help advance us to the next step is good nomenclature. Just like both OC, CC, and CCC are all good ways to carry a gun for self defense. Personal choice and all that.

Charles
If we cannot agree on the definition of terms, we will have difficulty in understanding each other. Therefore such nomenclature is highly desireable.
 

marine0300

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Topeka, Kansas, USA
College Gold Star

Grapeshot
When openencarry.org first started Kansas was not a gold star open carry state. You inspired us to strive to change the laws and we did! Thank you for bringing to light what needed fixed
Now that we have have a big victory on campus carry you choose to argue and knock our achievement. We are the first in the
United States of America to allow permitless carry on college campus. And the first thing you want to do is argue about constitutional vs permittless carry.
I don't appreciate your attitude. I don't believe your a friend to people who fight everyday inch at a time to improve our gun laws. If I can't post on opencarry.org our successes without being knocked by the administrators we will not post anymore.
Really a sad day for Opencarry.org
Marine0300
Kansas is the most constitutional carry state in the United States of America and we're proud of it!
 
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