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Inova Fairfax Medical Office Building

JamesCanby

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Alexandria, VA at www.NoVA-MDSelfDefense.com
As I walked into the Inova Fairfax Medical Office Building today, I noticed the following prohibition prominently displayed on the front door:

2014-06-12 10.19.07.jpg

(Click on the thumbnail to enlarge.)

It seems to provide notice of trespass by Concealed Carry, but not by OC. No other signs were evident related to carry of any other type of firearm or other weapon.

Also, I do not recognize the statutory code referenced in the notice, but I do not think it's state code. I'll do some research on Fairfax County code.
 

builtjeep

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 13, 2008
Messages
323
Location
South Chesterfield, VA
That's a Texas state code, required by law at any place that wants to ban concealed carry (They have no handgun open carry). Not sure of the legal ramifications, but I'm certain they can't enforce Texas law in VA.
 

wrearick

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Mar 6, 2013
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Virginia Beach, Va.
definately looks like a quote from the Texas statues although the wording of the 30.06 signage is different than what I see in the code. Not sure what the as ammended means.....:D maybe, as ammended to my use in a totally different state and referencing a section that I wrote that says "You can't do that"
 

JamesCanby

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So .... now I'm wondering if it IS Texas state code, does the notice have the force of law in Virginia? That is, do the words "Trespass", "Holder of a license to carry a concealed handgun", and "May not enter this property" carry specific meaning regardless of the origin of the Code?

Is a CCer automatically guilty of Trespass by ignoring that notice, or must someone in Hospital authority specifically advise the carrier that they are trespassing?

I'm just down the street from Inova Alexandria and I'll stop by there to see if they have the same notice on their door.
 

TFred

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Most historic town in, Virginia, USA
Let's reframe the question, and imagine a sign that reads:

"Pursuant to Section 13-3112, no permit is required to carry a concealed handgun on this property."

How do you think that would fly in Virginia? I'll tell you the answer: It would not, because the section of code under reference is Arizona code, and while perfectly legal and acceptable in Arizona, it does not apply to or supersede the Code of Virginia when you are in Virginia. Private property owners are not authorized by the Code of Virginia to allow visitors to ignore the CHP requirement.

TFred
 

JamesCanby

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Alexandria, VA at www.NoVA-MDSelfDefense.com
Let's reframe the question, and imagine a sign that reads:

"Pursuant to Section 13-3112, no permit is required to carry a concealed handgun on this property."

How do you think that would fly in Virginia? I'll tell you the answer: It would not, because the section of code under reference is Arizona code, and while perfectly legal and acceptable in Arizona, it does not apply to or supersede the Code of Virginia when you are in Virginia. Private property owners are not authorized by the Code of Virginia to allow visitors to ignore the CHP requirement.

TFred
I agree with you TF, that statutes cited that originate in a different state cannot be prosecuted in Virginia. What I am wondering is if the content of the notice, the words used, are sufficient to convey the notice that carrying a concealed firearm on their property is not allowed. Is it "constructive" notice rather than "legal" notice?

I'm assuming that the same notice is on the door at Inova Alexandria. If so, should we let well enough alone given that they cannot impose a Texas statute in Virginia, or would bringing this to their attention simply cause them to revise the notice to be Virginia compliant?
 

TFred

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I agree with you TF, that statutes cited that originate in a different state cannot be prosecuted in Virginia. What I am wondering is if the content of the notice, the words used, are sufficient to convey the notice that carrying a concealed firearm on their property is not allowed. Is it "constructive" notice rather than "legal" notice?

I'm assuming that the same notice is on the door at Inova Alexandria. If so, should we let well enough alone given that they cannot impose a Texas statute in Virginia, or would bringing this to their attention simply cause them to revise the notice to be Virginia compliant?
That is the same old question that has been debated over and over again, with no solid answer: does a mere sign communicating a policy satisfy the "proper notice" required to convict on trespass. I can't help but imagine that should you find yourself in front of a judge, the fact that they cited Texas code would only help your case.

In the mean time, I guess we can all laugh at them, someone obviously spent money to make the sign, thinking it was important. :lol:

TFred
 

Liberty-or-Death

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IMHO, it's definitely worded to make their wishes clear, and that they'd likely prosecute those they deem trespassers. As such, even though signs carry no weight of law in VA, I personally would not carry there. I'm torn over notifying them of their error also. I'd like to see them pay to remove it, but they'd likely post some other nonsense.

μολών λαβέ
 

JamesCanby

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Alexandria, VA at www.NoVA-MDSelfDefense.com
IMHO, it's definitely worded to make their wishes clear, and that they'd likely prosecute those they deem trespassers. As such, even though signs carry no weight of law in VA, I personally would not carry there. I'm torn over notifying them of their error also. I'd like to see them pay to remove it, but they'd likely post some other nonsense.

μολών λαβέ
You and I are thinking alike... But I'd still like to get someone from there to answer why they are quoting Texas law...
 

Brian D.

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Jul 27, 2007
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916
Location
Cincy area, Ohio, USA
You and I are thinking alike... But I'd still like to get someone from there to answer why they are quoting Texas law...
Maybe that medical outfit uses mouthpieces...er, lawyers, that are based in Texas? I could see Inova calling up their attorneys asking for guidance in posting "No Guns" signage. Taking care of this gets passed down from partner to associate to clerk to intern withing the law firm. That kid doesn't realize the difference in the two states' laws, nor is he very motivated to learn.

"Do not attribute to malice what can be adequetely explained by stupidity". Hanlon's Razor, as many of you already know.
 
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JamesCanby

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Jul 2, 2010
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Alexandria, VA at www.NoVA-MDSelfDefense.com
I go to all the Inova facilities and just have seen the no gun sticker equivalent posted. Next time I go I will have to ask security about it. Was it part of the main bldg?
Its on the Inova Fairfax campus, but a separate building from the hospital itself. It's where the doctors have their offices. I do seem to remember, however, that Inova Alexandria has the same Texas statute on its doors. I'll check it out later and respond.
 

Grapeshot

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May 21, 2006
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35,336
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Valhalla
Why don't yall open carry your long guns in there like we do in Texas.....:banghead:
Seriously?? Long guns????

Sorry you don't have open carry like Virginia, but No thanks.
It's a matter of effective public relations and long gun carry, while for the most part is legal, is not our focal point.

Presently the goal is not to challenge the entire concept of the Second Amendment here on OCDO, but to further the right to open carry handguns throughout our normal day. We've done pretty well to that regard - still room for improvement though.
 
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