matt2636
Regular Member
has anyone talked to a attorney about oc and encounter with Leo while ocing?
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has anyone talked to an attorney?
- Thread starter matt2636
- Start date
Tucker6900
Regular Member
What are you referencing?
Do you mean what you are legally required to do when approached by an LEO while open carrying?
I have not talked to one and IANAL, but here is what I understand.
There is nothing in Iowa Code 724 that requires a person carrying a firearm to show anything BUT a permit to carry weapons upon demand of an officer. As I understand it, of approached, one is not required to show id other than that.
Do you mean what you are legally required to do when approached by an LEO while open carrying?
I have not talked to one and IANAL, but here is what I understand.
There is nothing in Iowa Code 724 that requires a person carrying a firearm to show anything BUT a permit to carry weapons upon demand of an officer. As I understand it, of approached, one is not required to show id other than that.
Last edited:
matt2636
Regular Member
I spoke with one just out of curiosity and he pretty much said the some thing. Show your permit any questioning after that you would have the the right to remain silent if you wish. He sounded like he has been asked the question before and he might be a fellow gun owner himself but the way he talked about it just made it seem like 724 is a big grey area. I don't think he wanted to get to much into it one cause I would have to own for him to look into it more and he did want me saying "well this lawyer said this" he wasn't a dick about it but he did say in his personal opinion to cover if you can but it is your right to oc . It didn't really seem like legal advice otherwise I'm sure I'd have to pay.
amaixner
Regular Member
Yes, my most recent carry permit class (took it for renewal) was actually given by an attorney.
Are you asking for some specific reason?
matt2636
Regular Member
who gave your class? cause I might take it for the hell of it. My main reason to talk to one was to ask if I had to show my permit if ocing and stopped. I didn't know there was attorneys teaching the class though.
amaixner
Regular Member
That's a very easy question, actually.
If you are carrying in such a manner/location that a permit is required, and an officer requests/demands to see your permit, then yes, you must show your permit.
Remember that Iowa makes no distinction between open/concealed, except for allowing unpermitted open carry outside incorporated areas when not in a vehicle.
The class was given by Paul Horvick.
Tucker6900
Regular Member
+1
IANAL,
That is, according to the law, the only requirement for carrying a firearm in Iowa.
I have been approached only once by law enforcement while open carrying. I was fishing at Marr Park in Washington County. A deputy walked up, asked if I had caught anything, asked if I was going to shoot em if I couldnt catch one (a joke), and wished me a nice day. Didnt even ask for a permit.
From my experience with Iowa law enforcement, most of the ones that I have talked with, they dont care that we carry firearms. As long as were not being idiots while in possession, they have no problems. And FYI, Washington County Sheriffs department is pretty pro 2A. So there should be minimal issues with them.
mattsweet
New member
I've never had a real issue with LEOs in Iowa. Most are pro 2A anywhere you go with the slim exception of a few of the larger city officials (which are few and far between in this great land of corn).
In July of 2011, I was stopped by a Davenport LEO for carrying openly while walking down the street. His greeting was: "Hey, listen, we're new to this carry ordinance as well as you. I'm not going to bug you, I just need to see your permit."
After showing him my permit, he bid me a nice evening. It took all of 5 minutes and I was walking again. I'm really pleased with how well Iowa LEOs are handling the new law. A lot of my family (a lot of us carry) expected resistance, but honestly, it's been really smooth.
The only advice I could give someone who doesn't have regular access to an attorney would be don't run around all :banana: yelling: "I DON'T HAVE TO BE COOPERATIVE BECAUSE I HAVE A PERMIT." Be as cooperative as possible. The officer has rights just like you, and in my encounters so far; it's clearly evident that they just want to make sure you're legal and then get back to what they were doing prior. 9 times out of 10, they're stopping you because someone picked up the phone and called. They're required to respond.
I keep this ACLU "American's Rights" card in my wallet at all times. I know it by heart, but it's there just as a reminder: http://www.aclu.org/files/assets/bustcard_eng_20100630.pdf
AND...
Since the law is no longer new to LEOs, I politely and calmly inform the officer 4 things when stopped for open carry:
1. I have a permit to carry and will furnish it carefully upon request of the LEO.
(EXPLANATION: I will furnish my permit for you, thus remaining cooperative.)
2. I have the right to remain silent and reserve the right at this time.
(EXPLANATION: I will not answer any questions I feel irrelevant to the situation at hand. i.e. "where are you going?" "why are you carrying?")
3. I do not consent to the searching of my person or property.
(EXPLANATION: You do not have permission to search my body, pat me down, or check my storages, not limited to clothing storage.)
4. However, I will not resist any forceful attempt to search my person.
(EXPLANATION: I will not exert any physical retaliation should you decide to infringe upon my rights.)
This isn't to give the LEO a hard time, but rather paves a legal defense for you should the LEO infringe upon your rights. Albeit, that experience would be rare in Iowa, but if I didn't prefer safe over sorry, I wouldn't have a permit to carry in the first place.
Hope this helps. I know it's a long post!
In July of 2011, I was stopped by a Davenport LEO for carrying openly while walking down the street. His greeting was: "Hey, listen, we're new to this carry ordinance as well as you. I'm not going to bug you, I just need to see your permit."
After showing him my permit, he bid me a nice evening. It took all of 5 minutes and I was walking again. I'm really pleased with how well Iowa LEOs are handling the new law. A lot of my family (a lot of us carry) expected resistance, but honestly, it's been really smooth.
The only advice I could give someone who doesn't have regular access to an attorney would be don't run around all :banana: yelling: "I DON'T HAVE TO BE COOPERATIVE BECAUSE I HAVE A PERMIT." Be as cooperative as possible. The officer has rights just like you, and in my encounters so far; it's clearly evident that they just want to make sure you're legal and then get back to what they were doing prior. 9 times out of 10, they're stopping you because someone picked up the phone and called. They're required to respond.
I keep this ACLU "American's Rights" card in my wallet at all times. I know it by heart, but it's there just as a reminder: http://www.aclu.org/files/assets/bustcard_eng_20100630.pdf
AND...
Since the law is no longer new to LEOs, I politely and calmly inform the officer 4 things when stopped for open carry:
1. I have a permit to carry and will furnish it carefully upon request of the LEO.
(EXPLANATION: I will furnish my permit for you, thus remaining cooperative.)
2. I have the right to remain silent and reserve the right at this time.
(EXPLANATION: I will not answer any questions I feel irrelevant to the situation at hand. i.e. "where are you going?" "why are you carrying?")
3. I do not consent to the searching of my person or property.
(EXPLANATION: You do not have permission to search my body, pat me down, or check my storages, not limited to clothing storage.)
4. However, I will not resist any forceful attempt to search my person.
(EXPLANATION: I will not exert any physical retaliation should you decide to infringe upon my rights.)
This isn't to give the LEO a hard time, but rather paves a legal defense for you should the LEO infringe upon your rights. Albeit, that experience would be rare in Iowa, but if I didn't prefer safe over sorry, I wouldn't have a permit to carry in the first place.
Hope this helps. I know it's a long post!