Handgun in vehicle

[ronmanci]

I have heard seven different ways why you, your friend, Barrack Obama and Jesus Christ think that transporting loaded magazines in a separate locked container from a locked and contained firearm is a FOPA violation but you have yet to post one iota of actual law...you could be some 12 yr old behind a computer screen in Idaho for all I know, why am I supposed to take your word for anything? I see no training manuals, no memos, nothing to support or lend credibility to this interpretation other than your assertion that it is what is practiced...and not too often I have to assume because we have no reported evidence of anyone ever having been prosecuted for it no less you claiming to have been involved in an arrest.

I don't understand why you even attempted to discuss this if all you intended to contribute was, "This is what I was taught, this other guy agrees with me, if you have any questions, go screw yourself."

I have utilized every resource at my disposal to try to come up with a definitive answer and evidence to support YOUR claims, I have found nothing. You need to help me, and it needs to be better than, "This is what we do, take it or leave it," to be of any use... I have searchable access to every law in the country, every reported case dating back hundreds of years, I have scoured dozens of cases and executed dozens of searches for terms, statutory references, anything, and I see nothing related to the distinction that you and your friend draw. If you want to accomplish something, you're going to have to point me in the right direction here.

I was involved in an arrest of a gentleman that was OC'ing. That is what I stated. Do not twist my words to make yourself feel better.

I never stated to have been involved in a arrest of an out of state resident illegally possessing of firearm while traveling through the state. I did say that I must make that arrest if the situation ever occured. Maybe you should get your paralegal to start taking minutes for you while your on the computer.

 

[emsjeep]

I was involved in an arrest of a gentleman that was OC'ing. That is what I stated. Do not twist my words to make yourself feel better.

I never stated to have been involved in a arrest of an out of state resident illegally possessing of firearm while traveling through the state. I did say that I must make that arrest if the situation ever occured. Maybe you should get your paralegal to start taking minutes for you while your on the computer.

Thats exactly what I said, you have not provided any evidence of a prosecution for this nor have you claimed to have ever been involved in an arrest; don't twist my words.

 

[emsjeep]

I dont state it, or advocate it. I live it, everyday of my life. And like I said once before, give it a try and lets see how it works out for ya. In your mind it's justified, and you can make all the arguements you want, because reality says, you could very well be charged. Any member of my agency would charge you. And I know your next question is "with what" while quoting a hundred statutes. Truth is, a real attorney knows how things work in the crime business. Anyone can be charged for anything at anytime. Erroneous, inflated, exaggerated or not, the onus is now on the defendent. Innocent until proven guilty is nothing more than a slogan. Even a snot nose 12 year old should know that. I don't suggest my opinion is any better than yours, I'm only pointing out that right now, here in NYS, that your way WILL get you arrested, and then you can spend the rest of your life fighting the politicians. You'll have plenty of time to do that while your sitting in Greenhaven. Everyone is a lawyer in prison. My way gets you safely to your destination without hassel or worry. Do you really have to decide?

Besides the fact that I can't possibly "try it", I'm a NYS resident with a 400.00 license, you have provided another non-answer. Don't get me wrong, I appreciate your experience, it gives me a reasonable basis to continue with further research, and I'm doing all that I can, but I find no reasonable basis in law for your distinction. You can indiscriminately charge people with whatever you want, and the issue of NYSP misinterpreting the law is not what is in discussion here. If a client asked me about transporting through NY, sure, I would advise them of your standard and the way in which the law is, potentially wrongly, enforced by NY police agencies but this is a discussion of what the law is and isn't. One of the possible outcomes of this discussion may very well be communication with police agencies and or legislators geared towards correcting improper interpretation and enforcement of the law.

 

[1245A Defender]

well...

.................

 

[Chap]

Just a thought

Morning emsjeep,

Since we are all throwing our years of experience around, I've got 29 plus years in the Coast Guard. I've been a Boarding team member and a Boarding officer. (Carried a weapon on the water for the CG with Authority and Jurisdiction to arrest) I'm currently a Marine Inspector and Investigating Officer in Mississippi enforcing 46CFR & 33CFR on the MS River.

When I hit an impasse with Industry concerning my interpretation, I call another Marine Inspector or Investigating Officer for input. If all else fails, I call a lawyer or the person who whould defend my decision if it gets appealed by Industry.

Suggestion, if you’re a lawyer, couldn't you make a courtesy phone call to a lawyer who would defend a NYS police officer in court. (Possibly ronmanci dept lawyer)


Just throw around ideas with another lawyer, see what sticks. If they support ronmanci's side they might shed some light on the subject. If they are shocked and support your side then they might hold training to clear up the mis-understanding.

Kind of a win-win, although I do enjoy reading both of your points of view.

Chap

 

[emsjeep]

Morning emsjeep,

Since we are all throwing our years of experience around, I've got 29 plus years in the Coast Guard. I've been a Boarding team member and a Boarding officer. (Carried a weapon on the water for the CG with Authority and Jurisdiction to arrest) I'm currently a Marine Inspector and Investigating Officer in Mississippi enforcing 46CFR & 33CFR on the MS River.

When I hit an impasse with Industry concerning my interpretation, I call another Marine Inspector or Investigating Officer for input. If all else fails, I call a lawyer or the person who whould defend my decision if it gets appealed by Industry.

Suggestion, if you’re a lawyer, couldn't you make a courtesy phone call to a lawyer who would defend a NYS police officer in court. (Possibly ronmanci dept lawyer)


Just throw around ideas with another lawyer, see what sticks. If they support ronmanci's side they might shed some light on the subject. If they are shocked and support your side then they might hold training to clear up the mis-understanding.

Kind of a win-win, although I do enjoy reading both of your points of view.

Chap

I did contact an expert attorney on this, the answer was, basically, that there is no answer provided in the case law or other statutory language.

What this means...the best guess as to what the court will do will be based on an interpretation of the legislative reasoning, likely, something to do with accessibility of the firearm. Some question exists even as to the actual protections extended to any ammunition you might have (if, say, you were transporting hollow-points through NJ). The statute is ultimately a protection for legally owned firearms which are transported unloaded. My best interpretation of this would dictate that a firearm in a locked box, with no ammunition in that box, is, in the conventional sense unloaded...but my best support for that is a dictionary definition.

 

[stuckinchico]

An even better suggestion is to burn NY and CA down and start all over and let them learn a lesson not to do it again. BTW what is up with all them damn cameras in the city????? Dear god you guys let them put them up??? talk about privacy issues. thank god for things that block them