SCOTUS makes a good call for once!

[Ezek]

LOL.....yes because LGBT are not created by heteros........so they would have gone extinct.....

I think you nee to rethink this post it is very amusing.

this is several pages later but I think I was oversimplifying something.

I was actually taking it back pre-history days, like sticks and stones and very small communities days..
back then people with a same sex orientation would have been thrown out of the community due to the extent of difference, it is nto about the straight people made a gay person.

although the parents may be thrown out of the community as well cause they where "cursed" or whatever such nonsense.

either way if these banished people of same sex orientation formed a community, it probably would not last past the 1st ro 2nd generation, assuming some where actually Bi, due to disease, nutrition, ECT ect. and the problem that having multiple partners can bring with the spread of STD's.

 

[Dave_pro2a]

Ironic that only 1 person on this thread is actually throwing around personal insults, is the guy who calls people who disagree with him liars.

100% false accusations, total character attack, and totally unsubstantiated.

Name calling, totally ignored by OC moderators.

Not that I care much, just pointing out the hypocrisy.

 

[Dave_pro2a]

this is several pages later but I think I was oversimplifying something.

I was actually taking it back pre-history days, like sticks and stones and very small communities days..
back then people with a same sex orientation would have been thrown out of the community due to the extent of difference, it is nto about the straight people made a gay person.

although the parents may be thrown out of the community as well cause they where "cursed" or whatever such nonsense.

either way if these banished people of same sex orientation formed a community, it probably would not last past the 1st ro 2nd generation, assuming some where actually Bi, due to disease, nutrition, ECT ect. and the problem that having multiple partners can bring with the spread of STD's.

meh. Homosexual like behavior has been documented throughout time in many cultures. Including the Greek and Romans.

The Greek AND Romans, you know, the cradles of western civilization.

The same two cultures who used to routinely practice.... ORGIES!

 

[solus]

Hate to break it to you, but charles has been quite active in utah in helping get pro-rkba legislation passed into law.

But don't let me stop you from keeping this ad hominem going.

j- you mean piper's apparently dead website with the last reader feedback dating back to 2007 and the latest dated article 2014? you mean that type of active in helping with no apparent life of late in the website? http://www.goutahorg.org/

utah local news SLC Tribune talking about Clark Aposhian, gun lobbyist...quote: But it's Aposhian who is always present — striding through the halls with a Bluetooth headset in his ear and his phone constantly buzzing during 14-hour days during the 45-day legislative session. unquote.

same article discussing our dear piper... quote: a 42-year-old electrical engineer...and raises chickens and bees at his home in Sandy. unquote

mr. Aposhian discussing our dear piper...quote: We represent different people on the same issue. He can be a little more outspoken," Aposhian said. unquote http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/politics/55798012-90/gun-aposhian-utah-bill.html.csp

so j- so explain once more how calling those who challenge narcissistic piper on any level, names and making disparaging remarks about the poster(s) and he is the first to run to get someone to stop the bullying; his website is dead w/o benefit of decent burial; in the article, piper readily admits he doesn't show up to the capitol until the last day of legislative session; and even the renowned Utah gun lobbyist flat our says quote he can be a little more outspoken unquote, helped anything what-so-ever?

easy to ride on Aposhian's coat tails and claim victory but as janet jackson once sang about: what have you done for me lately?

ipse

 

[stealthyeliminator]

Ironic that only 1 person on this thread is actually throwing around personal insults, is the guy who calls people who disagree with him liars.

100% false accusations, total character attack, and totally unsubstantiated.

Name calling, totally ignored by OC moderators.

Not that I care much, just pointing out the hypocrisy.

Welcome to the 'enlightened' club.

Such activity has most certainly gone on before, and I suspect will likely continue into the future.

 

[J_dazzle23]

j- you mean piper's apparently dead website with the last reader feedback dating back to 2007 and the latest dated article 2014? you mean that type of active in helping with no apparent life of late in the website? http://www.goutahorg.org/

utah local news SLC Tribune talking about Clark Aposhian, gun lobbyist...quote: But it's Aposhian who is always present — striding through the halls with a Bluetooth headset in his ear and his phone constantly buzzing during 14-hour days during the 45-day legislative session. unquote.

same article discussing our dear piper... quote: a 42-year-old electrical engineer...and raises chickens and bees at his home in Sandy. unquote

mr. Aposhian discussing our dear piper...quote: We represent different people on the same issue. He can be a little more outspoken," Aposhian said. unquote http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/politics/55798012-90/gun-aposhian-utah-bill.html.csp

so j- so explain once more how calling those who challenge narcissistic piper on any level, names and making disparaging remarks about the poster(s) and he is the first to run to get someone to stop the bullying; his website is dead w/o benefit of decent burial; in the article, piper readily admits he doesn't show up to the capitol until the last day of legislative session; and even the renowned Utah gun lobbyist flat our says quote he can be a little more outspoken unquote, helped anything what-so-ever?

easy to ride on Aposhian's coat tails and claim victory but as janet jackson once sang about: what have you done for me lately?

ipse

Let's imagine for a moment that not everything one does gets told about online.

What a shock that would be.

Imagine for once that a single article or website may not include the day to day of someone's efforts to get pro-rkba legislation passed?

We could go into the pot calling the kettle black if you want to keep this off topic ad hominem going in an effort to discredit the posters character rather than his points he has made...

Regardless of your personal opinion of this person it gets annoying to see people come to the table with an ad hominem instead of addressing the point.

 

[Ezek]

meh. Homosexual like behavior has been documented throughout time in many cultures. Including the Greek and Romans.

The Greek AND Romans, you know, the cradles of western civilization.

The same two cultures who used to routinely practice.... ORGIES!

LOL yes I know of both of those, the romans actually promoted homosexual behavior among the ranks while on the front lines because they believed you would fight harder if your "lover" was next to you, in order to protect them.

the Greeks where the same.. not sure about the Spartan part of the Greeks though on that one.. they where pretty blood thirsty and didn't tolerate much in way of difference.. they even tossed any mutated/deformed young off a cliff to promote purity in their genetics..

also, these civilizations are post/during bronze age, not pre.

 

[Ezek]

I recall a rather large emphasis on children in many of the OT marriage accounts including Abraham and his wife Saria.

Jacob agreed to labor 7 years for Rachael and the years passed quickly because of his love for her. When he was tricked into marrying Leah first, he labored another 7 years out of love.

Not to mention the first marriage mentioned in the Bible: Adam and Eve and the Lord's command to them, "Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one flesh."

I think you may be over-simplifying and mis-stating the purposes of marriage in the OT. That their courtship rituals were different than ours (that developed only during the industrial revolution I might add), doesn't mean that marriage wasn't about love and children and the procreative act.




But what is it that makes society take any interest at all in an otherwise private relationship? Society doesn't care about my bridge club. They don't have any interest in the relationship between my best friend and me. It takes no real interest in my relationship with my business partner despite the fact that our financial fortunes are inextricably linked.

Ironically, the thing that gives society any real interest in my relationship, the thing that makes it of public concern, is the most private aspect of it: the act that brings children into the picture. Consenting adults can and do fend for themselves. But children are in a unique situation: They are not unto themselves, yet they are not merely property. Society has an interest in how the rising generation is raised, and a moral obligation to protect the weakest members of society, yet an equally strong moral requirement to respect the rights of parents to raise their children as they see fit within the broadest limits possible. It is from the marriage bed itself that legal spousal privilege derives: a man and his wife must be free to discuss their affairs without fear of one being required to testify against the other, lest the marriage relationship be damaged. Again, business partners enjoy no such privilege, nor do very close friends, nor even siblings.

It is one thing to argue that consenting adult homosexual couples, and polygamist trios and quads, and other various intimate arrangements deserve some way to record their choice of "next-of-kin". It is quite another to attempt to rewrite history and culture as to why society has ever cared to take notice of, give special benefit to, or encourage marriage between a man and a woman.

Charles

wasn't he also in fact promised a son if he listened to god and travelled to the promised land? and in his impatience slept with a maid who was fruitful which gave birth to Ishmael? but was later given a son through Saria as well?

amazing the emphasis on the desire for children here....

 

[DrakeZ07]

Can a mod/admin lock the thread, please? it's strayed so far from my original intent that it isn't even recognizable as a coherent congratulatory post. It's just down to idiots bashing idiots, and religious bashing religious, and more reasons for me to hate religions, and the magic underpants wearing types.ca

I cant PM grapeshot because my storm chasing laptop can barely run chrome, and its a headache just to type this stuff.

Plz l0ck. kthx.

 

[solus]

Let's imagine for a moment that not everything one does gets told about online.

What a shock that would be.

Imagine for once that a single article or website may not include the day to day of someone's efforts to get pro-rkba legislation passed?

We could go into the pot calling the kettle black if you want to keep this off topic ad hominem going in an effort to discredit the posters character rather than his points he has made...

Regardless of your personal opinion of this person it gets annoying to see people come to the table with an ad hominem instead of addressing the point.

remember j, it is a two way street on the annoying to have a member who continually disparages others, calls other member's names, all for challenging their, consistently uncited OPINIONATED rhetoric !!

go back and look at everyone of this member's posts and watch immediately if they are challenged even slightly, read the names the member is called and other disparaging comments about the poster who challenged this member.

imagine, shall we j, consider providing objective & verifiable statements about the goodness done instead of making subjective and unsubstantiated emotionalized statements about the bravado on accomplishments only to discern they are unsubstantiated bravado and as clint said so nicely...'legends in their own mind' mentality.

for goodness sake...he admits he has a 'date' with his partner and shows up on the last day of legislative session...ya that is a good idea to do glad hand'g on the day everyone goes home...

do not call this kettle black and claim argumentum ad hominem when the individual we are speaking about is the greatest slinger of personal attacks against any who even minutely challenge the biased bs he spews.

ipse

 

[J_dazzle23]

remember j, it is a two way street on the annoying to have a member who continually disparages others, calls other member's names, all for challenging their, consistently uncited OPINIONATED rhetoric !!

go back and look at everyone of this member's posts and watch immediately if they are challenged even slightly, read the names the member is called and other disparaging comments about the poster who challenged this member.

imagine, shall we j, consider providing objective & verifiable statements about the goodness done instead of making subjective and unsubstantiated emotionalized statements about the bravado on accomplishments only to discern they are unsubstantiated bravado and as clint said so nicely...'legends in their own mind' mentality.

for goodness sake...he admits he has a 'date' with his partner and shows up on the last day of legislative session...ya that is a good idea to do glad hand'g on the day everyone goes home...

do not call this kettle black and claim argumentum ad hominem when the individual we are speaking about is the greatest slinger of personal attacks against any who even minutely challenge the biased bs he spews.

ipse

What came first, chicken or egg?

 

[solus]

What came first, chicken or egg?

i notice not one word about accomplishments that was bragged about earlier...

nuff said!!!

ipse

 

[J_dazzle23]

View attachment 12651


i notice not one word about accomplishments that was bragged about earlier...

nuff said!!!

ipse

I notice not one word about another's posting bagging the "community" in utah.


*edit*

I mean seriously, solus, you're going to come into a thread started buy an individual that proceeds in said thread to launch into a page - long rant about how he hates religion, religious freedom, and religious people and throw it in everyone's face(which more than one poster noticed and noted) and then proceed to tell me that Charles is the jerk of the board?

Opinionated and loves to debate? Yeah I'll give you that. But seriously. Take a look around, solus.

 

[stealthyeliminator]

Can a mod/admin lock the thread, please? it's strayed so far from my original intent that it isn't even recognizable as a coherent congratulatory post. It's just down to idiots bashing idiots, and religious bashing religious, and more reasons for me to hate religions, and the magic underpants wearing types.ca

I cant PM grapeshot because my storm chasing laptop can barely run chrome, and its a headache just to type this stuff.

Plz l0ck. kthx.

Wow. Hypocrite much?

 

[J_dazzle23]

Can a mod/admin lock the thread, please? it's strayed so far from my original intent that it isn't even recognizable as a coherent congratulatory post. It's just down to idiots bashing idiots, and religious bashing religious, and more reasons for me to hate religions, and the magic underpants wearing types.ca

I cant PM grapeshot because my storm chasing laptop can barely run chrome, and its a headache just to type this stuff.

Plz l0ck. kthx.

As opposed to you (not religious) bashing religious here unprovoked?

*edit- ^^^beat me to it

 

[Dave_pro2a]

I mean seriously, solus, you're going to come into a thread started buy an individual that proceeds in said thread to launch into a page - long rant about how he hates religion, religious freedom, and religious people and throw it in everyone's face(which more than one poster noticed and noted) and then proceed to tell me that Charles is the jerk of the board?

Opinionated and loves to debate? Yeah I'll give you that. But seriously. Take a look around, solus.

And UtahBagger gets special treatment by mods Mafia level thread/post protection.

 

[utbagpiper]

I did not attempt to suggest that consistency is of no value to you. My suggestion was that consistency is not important enough to significantly influence your decisions, meaning, pointing out inconsistencies in your views will not deter you from them. My suggestion was that you may be ok with inconsistencies in your views.

That is a fair summary.

Thank you.

Charles

 

[utbagpiper]

wasn't he also in fact promised a son if he listened to god and travelled to the promised land? and in his impatience slept with a maid who was fruitful which gave birth to Ishmael? but was later given a son through Saria as well?

amazing the emphasis on the desire for children here....

He was promised an heir, and seed without number. As for impatience, Abraham's impatience or Sara's? (Gen 16:2) "And Sarai said unto Abram, Behold now, the Lord hath restrained me from bearing: I pray thee, go in unto my maid; it may be that I may obtain children by her. And Abram hearkened to the voice of Sarai."

And to be clear, under the God-given rules of marriage in the day, his relationship with Hagar was moral and permissible. At least up to the point he and Sarah kicked them out.

Did you have a point other than to attack Old Testament prophets for being fallible mortals? Or perhaps to ridicule polygamy in some way?

My point is that going back to Old Testament times, and certainly for the last couple of hundred years in this nation, a significant reason for marriage and for the government to take interest in marriage is the issue of children, the rising generation.

Charles

 

[Ezek]

He was promised an heir, and seed without number. As for impatience, Abraham's impatience or Sara's? (Gen 16:2) "And Sarai said unto Abram, Behold now, the Lord hath restrained me from bearing: I pray thee, go in unto my maid; it may be that I may obtain children by her. And Abram hearkened to the voice of Sarai."

And to be clear, under the God-given rules of marriage in the day, his relationship with Hagar was moral and permissible. At least up to the point he and Sarah kicked them out.

Did you have a point other than to attack Old Testament prophets for being fallible mortals? Or perhaps to ridicule polygamy in some way?

My point is that going back to Old Testament times, and certainly for the last couple of hundred years in this nation, a significant reason for marriage and for the government to take interest in marriage is the issue of children, the rising generation.

Charles

it was neither actually, I was actually in agreement that the old testament on that particular subject WAS about child rearing/procreation.

 

[Grapeshot]

Thread closed at request of OP - has drifted far off topic + been reduced to ad hominem attacks.