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OK, this threat to the 4A is getting dangerous.

FreedomVA

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How about a trademark. If they're gunna get my DNA then they will need to pay me for its use.

How about keeping the DNA banks, (Private and Encryted) as intended...Open the book law for citizens to sue private companies if they breach contract.

If Leo want or need to have access to the database, get a warrant as the 4th is intended to be use.
 

eye95

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How about a trademark. If they're gunna get my DNA then they will need to pay me for its use.
Don’t forget the problem as stated in the OP is not the government’s obtaining of your DNA. It is them going to DNA companies to inspect the DNA of close relatives (or, when they have no suspect and are casting a wide net, many persons’ DNA, in the hope of finding a partial match and identifying a family member of some future suspect).

Did the people who sent their DNA into one of these DNA database companies intend that DNA to be used for the government to be able to find a family member?
 

FreedomVA

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FreedomVA...just look at the recent debacles
  1. TX to get open carry - affected the nation’s firearm carrying citizens.
  2. WA & OR plight from “citizens initiative” [read well funded single entities pushing their agenda].
There is no sole enity heading up the push nor controlling the local grassroots who use it as a personal profit center or ‘look at me’ device.

I once heard a saying,, "If not now, When"? I see pro-guns groups are all over the map and many heads to the current dragon. I believe it's time to unite find a common denominator.

Too many Chiefs right now.
 

eye95

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How about keeping the DNA banks, (Private and Encryted) as intended...Open the book law for citizens to sue private companies if they breach contract.

If Leo want or need to have access to the database, get a warrant as the 4th is intended to be use.
I think that would require new law, similar to law that protects medical records, law that restrains the actions of DNA companies and their employees, much like medical personnel are barred from releasing personal medical information, except with permission or a with a warrant, or for some other narrowly defined purpose.

Right now, DNA companies believe that they own the DNA information and can release it at their will.
 

FreedomVA

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I think that would require new law, similar to law that protects medical records, law that restrains the actions of DNA companies and their employees, much like medical personnel are barred from releasing personal medical information, except with permission or a with a warrant, or for some other narrowly defined purpose.

Right now, DNA companies believe that they own the DNA information and can release it at their will.

This is my point......we need to unite to fight infringed law or non (such these to insure our Constitutional Rights).....that get put into law behind the public backs......behind close doors.....I don't believe this is how the Founders wanted the Framework to be.

Even your title, Eye95,
OK, this threat to the 4A is getting dangerous
 
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solus

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Freedom the nice LEs are not putting the sample in to those companies as “suspect xyz” but rather “I am looking for my realative(s)” and they are not flying the LE banner but rather a pseudonym name and address.

Remember the nice LEs have been given legal permission to lie to the citizenry.

Once they get the results, then and only then does the 4th become relative.
 

OC for ME

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Terms of service agreements are a powerful weapon against restoring individual liberty and the restraint of the state.

Apple has extremely deep pockets and was willing to spend the resources to say NO!! to the FBI. These minuscule DNA repositories enjoy no such luxury. Cops walk up to them and threaten them with bad press and astronomical legal fees if they don't comply.
 

FreedomVA

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Keep in mind the opponents ultimate goal is to Abolished the 2A, they can't go direct so they circumvent and infringed on our other rights to get to the 2A.
 

color of law

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Terms of service agreements are a powerful weapon against restoring individual liberty and the restraint of the state.

Apple has extremely deep pockets and was willing to spend the resources to say NO!! to the FBI. These minuscule DNA repositories enjoy no such luxury. Cops walk up to them and threaten them with bad press and astronomical legal fees if they don't comply.
Not necessarily so. Forty years ago OHSA showed up at the door wanting to inspect (no complaint). I asked if they had a warrant. No, but they can get one. I said when you do your affidavit better contain proof that the business is involved in interstate commerce. They never came back.
 

solus

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Terms of service agreements are a powerful weapon against restoring individual liberty and the restraint of the state.

Apple has extremely deep pockets and was willing to spend the resources to say NO!! to the FBI. These minuscule DNA repositories enjoy no such luxury. Cops walk up to them and threaten them with bad press and astronomical legal fees if they don't comply.

FBI still spent almost 1M [taxpayer $$$] for third party hacker and lo and behold no objective evidence against the man/wife!
 

solus

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Keep in mind the opponents ultimate goal is to Abolished the 2A, they can't go direct so they circumvent and infringed on our other rights to get to the 2A.

No that is not their goal per se...severely cripple and control YES....abolish NO as they know that approach will cause anarchy!
 

OC for ME

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Not necessarily so. Forty years ago OHSA showed up at the door wanting to inspect (no complaint). I asked if they had a warrant. No, but they can get one. I said when you do your affidavit better contain proof that the business is involved in interstate commerce. They never came back.
OSHA is not cops. Anyway, your OSHA example does not address the willingness of a fledgling e-business rebuking the cops in a manner as would a Apple Inc.
 

FreedomVA

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i am a consumer when i go to the DNA company and PAY for a service. As such i should have a reasonable belief and expectation that my information is protected (and i believe there are contracts in place to protect me from that)., i should not have to worry about my personal information being handed out like raffle tickets for a service i PAID for.
 

eye95

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This is my point......we need to unite to fight infringed law or non (such these to insure our Constitutional Rights).....that get put into law behind the public backs......behind close doors.....I don't believe this is how the Founders wanted the Framework to be.

Even your title, Eye95,
OK, this threat to the 4A is getting dangerous
Requiring private DNA companies to keep customer DNA information confidential would not be a constitutional issue. It would be accomplished, like privacy of medical information, by legislation.
 

OC for ME

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Courts are way behind on this issue, intentionally so in my opinion. Then again, we OCers (2A exercisers in general) also use the "if it ani't mentioned in the law then it is legal." Cop shops are not staffed with fans of individual liberty and they will continue to violate rights, as in OVI checkpoints, under court blessings, or continue using a "stingray device" absent a court's rebuke.
 

eye95

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For individuals, the theory should be: If the law does not make it illegal, it is legal.

For cops (and government agents in general), it should be: If the law does not give them the authority, they do not have it.
 

FreedomVA

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Courts are way behind on this issue, intentionally so in my opinion. Then again, we OCers (2A exercisers in general) also use the "if it ani't mentioned in the law then it is legal." Cop shops are not staffed with fans of individual liberty and they will continue to violate rights, as in OVI checkpoints, under court blessings, or continue using a "stingray device" absent a court's rebuke.

So, COPS should not be considered Constitutional Officers? Should i just consider them as "Security Guards" from now on?
 
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