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Citizen protects deputy - kills suspect

hammer6

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Video of the incident has been released.

http://www.nbc-2.com/story/34846661...-samaritan-shooting?sf63270253=1&sf63606875=1

Interesting actions by all involved.

Most of the videos I saw showed the deputy up on his knees after the shooting, shortly after the man drops the gun. I have not seen a video of the full time afterwards of the deputy staying on the ground. If you have please put a link.

this video that was posted above. the cop was on his knees after the shooting for about 30 seconds, then was prostrate on the ground. in the second angle, you can see the gun on the ground next to the tan truck, and someone was standing there...so not only did he drop it on the ground and walk away, he left it next to someone whom he didn't know.
 

utbagpiper

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Charles, please answer my query in post #11

Why would you want me to answer that query or otherwise prolong the off topic discussion after you explicitly wrote:

"...we should probably move forward and debate more important issues"

But to answer your query, No, I've never heard a police officer yell "freeze" at all. The closest I've come is one time a police officer calmly directed, "Please keep your hands on your wheel where I can see them," after effecting a traffic stop as he walked past my open window to look at the front of the car. He then walked back to my window and said, "We're looking for a vehicle and yours matched it from the rear. But from the front it obviously isn't you. Sorry for the inconvenience. Have a nice day."

Have you ever heard a police officer yell, "Freeze. Law Enforcement Officer."? How often are you in a situation that police officers are yelling "freeze" to or near you?

Now, since we are asking each other to answer queries, and since I've been so polite as to answer yours, would you be so polite as to answer my queries in post #10?

Reciprocation seems only appropriate.

Charles
 

WalkingWolf

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this video that was posted above. the cop was on his knees after the shooting for about 30 seconds, then was prostrate on the ground. in the second angle, you can see the gun on the ground next to the tan truck, and someone was standing there...so not only did he drop it on the ground and walk away, he left it next to someone whom he didn't know.
I can't tell from that video, but again the shooter was most likely in shock. He did the right thing IMO, and afterwards I am not going to knock him because he dropped his gun. He might have done that also not to get shot himself by responders. Have you ever been in a shooting resulting in loss of life?
 

countryclubjoe

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You explicitly asserted that no police officer in NY considers himself a peace officer. What is beyond that to imply? What do you mean to suggest by asserting that no big city police officer considers himself a peace officer? (As assertion I believe is false as I believe I could find a fair number of big city police officers who do consider themselves peace officers.)

Were I to infer something, you might take offense or claim I was putting words in your mouth.

Perhaps one ought to either be a bit more explicit, or else leave the implications and innuendo entirely un-written so as to avoid incorrect and potentially offensive inferences from the reader. No?

I stand by my opinion, no big city police officer considers himself/herself to be a peace officer..

Charles, we can go around an around on this insignificant detail.. I propose we save our brain power for a more serious topic to debate.
Always a pleasure opining with you Sir!
Regards
CCJ
 

utbagpiper

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I stand by my opinion, no big city police officer considers himself/herself to be a peace officer..

You've made that clear. And yet you are declining to answer my query after I was kind enough to answer yours.

It is not a matter of brain power, it is matter of civility and mutual respect. Why are you dodging my question after I was kind enough to directly answer yours?

CCJ, please answer my query in post #10.

"You explicitly asserted that no police officer in NY considers himself a peace officer. What is beyond that to imply? What do you mean to suggest by asserting that no big city police officer considers himself a peace officer?"

Charles
 

countryclubjoe

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You've made that clear. And yet you are declining to answer my query after I was kind enough to answer yours.

It is not a matter of brain power, it is matter of civility and mutual respect. Why are you dodging my question after I was kind enough to directly answer yours?

CCJ, please answer my query in post #10.

"You explicitly asserted that no police officer in NY considers himself a peace officer. What is beyond that to imply? What do you mean to suggest by asserting that no big city police officer considers himself a peace officer?"

Charles

Ill try my best to answer your query and explain my post... In 21st century America, there exist no "peace officers".. Peace officers as we know them, do not carry guns, think bobbies, bobbies were peace officers... No agency in 21st America, advertises for peace officers, they advertise for police officers.. Have you ever seen a government agency wearing a jacket at a crime scene that stated " peace officer".. I have visited many crime scenes in my career an have yet to see any one wearing a jacket or official ID that states, " I am a peace office"..

Charles, may be in Utah there are peace officers, however in NY, NJ and PA there is in reality no such animal.. Now can we move on to more important issues..

I have never seen an employment ad, seeking peace officers, however I have seen many agency's seeking " Police officers'..

Again reasonable minds, can go around and around on the topic, however a true definitive meaning will never be established..

May be in Utah there exist peace officers, however in NY and NJ there is no such animal..

Charles, this is all I have to offer on the topic, if your query is not satisfied, I respectfully suggest that we move forward onto more important issues..

In my opinion, peace officers do not break down doors at 4AM and serve warrants, that task falls on the shoulders of " Police officers"..

Charles, always a pleasure opining with you Sir!
Regards
CCJ
 

hammer6

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I can't tell from that video, but again the shooter was most likely in shock. He did the right thing IMO, and afterwards I am not going to knock him because he dropped his gun. He might have done that also not to get shot himself by responders. Have you ever been in a shooting resulting in loss of life?

no.

and you're missing the entire point.

isn't this forum for education?

wouldn't a better option have been to re-holster the weapon?

or, shouldn't we want to educate anyone who may be involved in a shooting on some safe protocol?

i mean, dude fired 3 shots, there's a 99.99% chance that gun had more bullets left in it. and there was a 50% chance that the person standing near where he left the gun on the ground was a bad guy.

in my mind, that's just sheer stupidity. isn't one of the top rules of gun safety to maintain control of your weapon at all times?

i get that he didn't want police arriving late to think he was a bad guy. but come on, seriously?
 

WalkingWolf

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no.

and you're missing the entire point.

isn't this forum for education?

wouldn't a better option have been to re-holster the weapon?

or, shouldn't we want to educate anyone who may be involved in a shooting on some safe protocol?

i mean, dude fired 3 shots, there's a 99.99% chance that gun had more bullets left in it. and there was a 50% chance that the person standing near where he left the gun on the ground was a bad guy.

in my mind, that's just sheer stupidity. isn't one of the top rules of gun safety to maintain control of your weapon at all times?

i get that he didn't want police arriving late to think he was a bad guy. but come on, seriously?

NO, you are missing the point, shooting another human being for most of us who are sane will be extremely traumatic. A lot of things can happen to the thought process of anyone in shock. I ask you again as a Monday morning quarterback, have you ever been in a shooting that resulted in the loss of human life?

 

OC for ME

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All depends on why I shot the criminal. There are a very few scenarios where I would enjoy a cold beer and call it a good day...but this is just me.
 

hammer6

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NO, you are missing the point, shooting another human being for most of us who are sane will be extremely traumatic. A lot of things can happen to the thought process of anyone in shock. I ask you again as a Monday morning quarterback, have you ever been in a shooting that resulted in the loss of human life?


i answered the question already my man. it was the first line of my response, NO.


i understand a lot of things can happen in the thought process of anyone in shock.

but isn't that what training and education is for?

isn't that why we are on this forum? do dissect events and figure out how to make them better, if possible, in the future?

relax my man. relax.
 

WalkingWolf

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i answered the question already my man. it was the first line of my response, NO.


i understand a lot of things can happen in the thought process of anyone in shock.

but isn't that what training and education is for?

isn't that why we are on this forum? do dissect events and figure out how to make them better, if possible, in the future?

relax my man. relax.

You can't train for killing someone, without killing someone, use some common sense instead of being anal judgemental.
 

hammer6

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You can't train for killing someone, without killing someone, use some common sense instead of being anal judgemental.

i'm not being anal judgmental. i'm not being judgmental at all. i didn't comment on the shooting. i commented on what happened after the fact. as responsible as he was, and as patient as he was, and as under control as he was throughout the entire sequence of events, he completely brain farted and endangered everyone in the area by putting his gun on the ground and walking away.

what's wrong with me pointing this out? do you advocate this kind of reckless behavior?
 

WalkingWolf

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i'm not being anal judgmental. i'm not being judgmental at all. i didn't comment on the shooting. i commented on what happened after the fact. as responsible as he was, and as patient as he was, and as under control as he was throughout the entire sequence of events, he completely brain farted and endangered everyone in the area by putting his gun on the ground and walking away.

what's wrong with me pointing this out? do you advocate this kind of reckless behavior?

YOU are making a judgement call on a man that had to do a very traumatic thing with ABSOLUTELY no experience of your own to base it on. IMO that is anal judgemental.

So what is wrong with me pointing out your behavior? No different than you on him, but you are not under extreme stress, and having your life changed forever, by people like you.
 
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hammer6

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YOU are making a judgement call on a man that had to do a very traumatic thing with ABSOLUTELY no experience of your own to base it on. IMO that is anal judgemental.

So what is wrong with me pointing out your behavior? No different than you on him, but you are not under extreme stress, and having your life changed forever, by people like you.

ok dude. cool stuff.
 

countryclubjoe

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ok dude. cool stuff.

Hammer6--- No sense attempting a civil discourse with Mr.Curmudgeon, he never lost an argument in his life.. Let's just aspire not to be so intemperate
when we reach his age..

Stay well Sir.

CCJ

And yes, I agree we your assessment.
 
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