Can Someone Please Explain Why Obamacare is Bad?

[rushcreek2]

When the " Affordable " Care Act was passed I immediately went on line as soon as the text of the law was available - and read the dang thing.

I'm not offering a link for you , but I expect it is still available if you google it.

Every other sentence in that law goes something like "........as the Secretary of the Department of Health and Human Service shall determine, or direct........"

If you are happy with the IRS abuses of power - you are going to really love the Affordable Care Act.

Remember that WHOEVER the Secretary of DHHS is - appointed by ANY future President- the The ACA has all of the ingredients for being abused. What ever the federal " Monarch " grants can be augmented by bureaucratic " stipulations" - or simply withdrawn at any time.

Nowhere in the U.S. Constitution - under express or implied powers granted to the federal government is their establishment linkage to this manifestation of a power grab by the federal government.

 

[MAC702]

...Insurance companies should not be able to disqualify you based on pre-existing conditions. The whole premise of that is absurd. They want us to pay for insurance based on the fact the odds are they will never have to pay out huge sums of money on our behalf, or that the money they make as a whole will offset the amount paid out....

How is the premise absurd? If insurance companies didn't make a profit, there would be no insurance companies. If there are arguments for both sides, calling the other side absurd is not the way to win the argument.

Insurance companies play the odds? Are you sure you understand what "insurance" means? Before insurance was available, we all played the odds. But when it became easier to buy insurance instead of saving money for ourselves, just in case, there became a market for insurance. It's like a "pool" for "just-in-case" money because not everyone needs just-in-case money at the same time, and some may never need it, but pay for the privilege of having it available.

Should an insurance company be forced to have the same rates for a 24-year old that they have for an 84-year old? Should they have the same rate for someone who has a preexisting condition, when that person already has a great chance of needing the "just-in-case" money? If you say no, which may be a valid opinion, just realize that this means EVERYONE's rates are higher to pay for those with greater risks. I am forcing a healthy person to pay more even though I am more likely to need medical care. Like I said, it may be a valid opinion if you can sell it as how our country should operate, but it is contrary to the business practices that once made America the richest nation on the planet with the highest standard of living. When we screwed with how business could operate, we started plummeting into poverty and homelessness and laziness because businesses lost their incentives to expand and hire.* Now socialism is being brought to us as the answer to those problems, when it was microsocialism that took us there in the first place.

As for this thread, I, too, would like to know in a nutshell what Obamacare actually does. Because all I hear are the soundbites of propaganda from each side, and that doesn't tell us anything.

*I own a business that could expand. My first employee would have to be the person who could understand all the paperwork involved in having employees. Screw that.

 

[eye95]

The choice was not mine, and although I am covered by the VA, it is only for 5 years (3 years left), and I can only receive treatment at a VA facility, which is about an hour from my house. No good in case of an emergency, such as a car accident. When EMS came and pulled me out of my car and put me into an ambulance, they took me to the nearest facility. NOT covered by VA, but would be covered by insurance, IF I COULD GET IT.

Then the military is anticipating that you will not have this condition after the five years, or the coverage would continue. If, considering your condition, and that it was serious enough to put you out of the military, you choose not to live near a facility that would provide you free (or nearly free) medical attention is your choice. You alone are responsible for it and its consequences.

As far as a traffic accident goes, does your condition prevent you from acquiring auto insurance? What about accident (non-auto) insurance?

However, all of that is just eyewash. *I* am not in the least responsible for the unfortunate stuff that happens to you.


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<o>

 

[sudden valley gunner]

It's good to know the history of why health care is so expensive too.

Yep government had a huge hand in that too.

They help create the problem and then tout they have the solution, which inevitably create more problems they don't doubt will tell us they can solve.

 

[MAC702]

And what exactly constitutes a "pre-existing condition?"

If you don't try to acquire health insurance until after you find out that you are going to need it*, should you pay the same low rate as the guy who bought it when he was healthy and actually looked at it as "insurance?"

*It's not really "insurance" any more at this point, is it?

 

[Ca Patriot]

It's good to know the history of why health care is so expensive too.

Yep government had a huge hand in that too.

They help create the problem and then tout they have the solution, which inevitably create more problems they don't doubt will tell us they can solve.

Government in a nutt shell.

Create a problem with laws and regulations and then tell the people that the government is the only solution.

If America had a true open and free market for health services then the costs would be very low and much more affordable for everyone.

I dont have insurance and since I pay cash things are MUCH cheaper than everyone who has insurance. I dont have to pay for all the fools who neglect their health with their own poor choices.

Thats freedom.

I mean, that WAS freedom. Not anymore though.

 

[ADobbs1989]

This country wouldn't be able to run on self-regulation anymore. We are all too greedy and people have grown so accustom to the government telling everyone what to do and when that if we all of a sudden got rid of all government regulations the big business owners would increase their wealth by squeezing it out of everyone else. The same reason raising minimum wage doesn't ever increase the quality of life for the people living on minimum wage. Force the rich to pay more, they increase costs to keep their profits up, effectively bypassing wage increases. Anyone who seriously thinks this country would flourish left to it's own devices anymore are kidding themselves.

 

[Citizen]

When it comes to government-enforced coverage for pre-existing conditions, lets not overlook infringing the contract rights of the insurance company.

I'm not thrilled with the historic behavior of some insurance companies when it comes to denying claims; but, I'm even less thrilled with handing government the power to tell people who they must contract with.

 

[ron73440]

 

[KBCraig]

And what exactly constitutes a "pre-existing condition?"

If you don't try to acquire health insurance until after you find out that you are going to need it*, should you pay the same low rate as the guy who bought it when he was healthy and actually looked at it as "insurance?"

*It's not really "insurance" any more at this point, is it?

Every time I've looked at health insurance with exclusions for pre-existing conditions, they have all contained an exclusionary period. They don't cover the pre-existing condition for that time period, but cover it after that. Squandering away two years of VA coverage without at least creating a health savings account and high-deductible plan, is unwise.

One of my sons is diabetic, so I have had to look at this.

 

[Esanders2008]

Every time I've looked at health insurance with exclusions for pre-existing conditions, they have all contained an exclusionary period. They don't cover the pre-existing condition for that time period, but cover it after that. Squandering away two years of VA coverage without at least creating a health savings account and high-deductible plan, is unwise.

One of my sons is diabetic, so I have had to look at this.

Additionally, once you do obtain coverage, the premiums can really get expensive. Prohibitively so.

 

[ron73440]

Additionally, once you do obtain coverage, the premiums can really get expensive. Prohibitively so.

I still haven't seen why it's OK to force the transfer of wealth to cover this.

If somone robbed you at gunpoint to give money to a poor single mother, that is still theft.

If you think taxes aren't taken at gunpoint, just refuse to pay them and the kindness of the government will soon be revealed to you.

Unfortunately, America has been taught that the first answer to a problem should be government, even better if it makes those evil rich pay their "fair share".

 

[rushcreek2]

My wife and I are both on Medicare Part B and have excellent secondary coverage-for a total annual premium in excess of of $6,000. Wife's prescription drug co-pay runs about $3,000 per year on top of that.

That's over 9 grand a year that we don't have to spend on discretionary interests. Most of the "uninsured" frankly choose not spend that huge of a chunk of their income on health insurance premiums. They would rather that I pay another $3,000.00 in inflated premiums in order to provide them with low premium health care coverage.

I am surrounded by family members who say they cannot afford health insurance, but they have 2 new cars, HD TV's, attend Cowboy , and Rangers game regularly....so I'm supposed to anti-up for them ?

Watching the NATGEO special " North America" last night I was reminded of " nature's total indifference" to the hand that is dealt to ALL of the inhabitants of this planet.

At least the members of the animal kingdom take extraordinary steps to defend themselves against the crap that comes down upon them.

That also brings to mind the fact that most people don't take pro-active steps to protect themselves from criminal predators. They naively opt to depend upon a 911 call to rescue them from " nature's indifference ". I'm thinking about the young woman shot by the COP the other day while being held hostage by a predator. Had she prepared herself adequately to defend against such known threats that are prevalent in our society the outcome would have been different.

 

[eye95]

I still haven't seen why it's OK to force the transfer of wealth to cover this.

If somone robbed you at gunpoint to give money to a poor single mother, that is still theft.

If you think taxes aren't taken at gunpoint, just refuse to pay them and the kindness of the government will soon be revealed to you.

Unfortunately, America has been taught that the first answer to a problem should be government, even better if it makes those evil rich pay their "fair share".

Yeah. That.

Some people don't like big government--except when that big government is giving them something.

I qualified for reduced-price lunches when I was a young airmen with a daughter in elementary school. We could prepare her a nutritious and inexpensive lunch at home, so we chose not to take the "free" money from the one hand while its mate was quietly shackling us. The school got most indignant. It seems that they lost some "free" money of their own, not having as many kids on the dole.

No. I don't care how much one perceives the need, it is still robbery to force me to pay for any of his "needs."

 

[OC for ME]

The thread title/question contains the answer to the question. Obamacare is "bad" because Obama and his liberal minions wanted Obamacare.

 

[MSG Laigaie]

I had the misfortune of being sideswiped last year. My medical bills, since I was uninsured, reached into the thousands. Who has the money to pay for that out of pocket?

You were uninsured, but drove the vehicle anyway. Your choice. I do not want to chip in to help repair your vehicle or help with injuries. Do you carry a weapon without bullets, than why drive uninsured?

I'm not advocating it, I'm seeking information. And if MY hands were TRULY in YOUR pockets right now, I would expect a severe case of acute lead poisoning!

How do you remedy this situation when it is your government with its hands in your pocket??


On paying cash for medical. My Father-in-law lived off the grid. He went to a hospital on an emergency and got one of those ten thousand dollar bills as he left. His question of "How much for cash?" was received by shocked ears. They settled for 2K and were happy. This works if you are prepared or have planned for illness/injury.
A great deal of people in my Country live off the government because they can and because they have been led in to subservience to the government. I chose to plan for my retirement and the medical to go with it. In my life I have lost everything and started over several times in my life. I do not want to hear your whining about health care and I do not want to "make up" for YOUR shortfalls in planning. If you are not happy with your life, bloody fix it. If you need help, ask, if you want someone to support you because you did not plan?? Get off my lawn!!

 

[ron73440]

Yeah. That.

Some people don't like big government--except when that big government is giving them something.

I qualified for reduced-price lunches when I was a young airmen with a daughter in elementary school. We could prepare her a nutritious and inexpensive lunch at home, so we chose not to take the "free" money from the one hand while its mate was quietly shackling us. The school got most indignant. It seems that they lost some "free" money of their own, not having as many kids on the dole.

No. I don't care how much one perceives the need, it is still robbery to force me to pay for any of his "needs."

I had the same problem when I signed my kids up at a new school.

Maybe that's why the administrator was so adamant I signed up, but I can feed my kids without the government "help".

(I had three kids at the time on a Sgt paycheck, and my wife doesn't work outside of our house.)

 

[Esanders2008]

You were uninsured, but drove the vehicle anyway. Your choice. I do not want to chip in to help repair your vehicle or help with injuries. Do you carry a weapon without bullets, than why drive uninsured?


How do you remedy this situation when it is your government with its hands in your pocket??


On paying cash for medical. My Father-in-law lived off the grid. He went to a hospital on an emergency and got one of those ten thousand dollar bills as he left. His question of "How much for cash?" was received by shocked ears. They settled for 2K and were happy. This works if you are prepared or have planned for illness/injury.
A great deal of people in my Country live off the government because they can and because they have been led in to subservience to the government. I chose to plan for my retirement and the medical to go with it. In my life I have lost everything and started over several times in my life. I do not want to hear your whining about health care and I do not want to "make up" for YOUR shortfalls in planning. If you are not happy with your life, bloody fix it. If you need help, ask, if you want someone to support you because you did not plan?? Get off my lawn!!

No health insurance. I have comprehensive auto.

 

[eye95]

No health insurance. I have comprehensive auto.

Was it comprehensive enough to cover injuries? If you had no health insurance, you'd be foolish not to have insurance against accidental injury--unless you are expecting the rest of us to pay for YOUR lack of foresight--which I think you are.

 

[WalkingWolf]

Was it comprehensive enough to cover injuries? If you had no health insurance, you'd be foolish not to have insurance against accidental injury--unless you are expecting the rest of us to pay for YOUR lack of foresight--which I think you are.

Stop whining, it is the law, obey it!