• We are now running on a new, and hopefully much-improved, server. In addition we are also on new forum software. Any move entails a lot of technical details and I suspect we will encounter a few issues as the new server goes live. Please be patient with us. It will be worth it! :) Please help by posting all issues here.
  • The forum will be down for about an hour this weekend for maintenance. I apologize for the inconvenience.
  • If you are having trouble seeing the forum then you may need to clear your browser's DNS cache. Click here for instructions on how to do that
  • Please review the Forum Rules frequently as we are constantly trying to improve the forum for our members and visitors.

How to get blacks to open carry??

BB62

Accomplished Advocate
Joined
Aug 17, 2006
Messages
4,069
Location
Cincinnati, Ohio, USA
I am a black man and I open carry in the Southside of Richmond, Va. I am also part of a small gun club. Chair and founded by another black man. Vice-chair by my wife ( who got me into open carrying) who is Asian. So there is black men who open carry.
Thanks for posting. If you're ever up this way, let me know!

I would very much appreciate it if you would talk about how your wife got you into OCing, and what your experiences are/opinion is about other blacks doing so (or alternatively saying "Hell no!").

Thanks again.
 
Last edited:

Rusty Young Man

Regular Member
Joined
Jun 19, 2013
Messages
1,548
Location
Árida Zona
I am a black man and I open carry in the Southside of Richmond, Va. I am also part of a small gun club. Chair and founded by another black man. Vice-chair by my wife ( who got me into open carrying) who is Asian. So there is black men who open carry.

Welcome to OCDO and greetings from sunny, dry Arizona Dranmo9715! :)

Great to hear another couple has decided to carry, and Openly at that. :D

I'm a sub-25 Hispanic male and have been lucky enough to find a gal who is accepting of my OC and carries herself. :)
 

deepdiver

Campaign Veteran
Joined
Apr 2, 2007
Messages
5,820
Location
Southeast, Missouri, USA
I am a black man and I open carry in the Southside of Richmond, Va. I am also part of a small gun club. Chair and founded by another black man. Vice-chair by my wife ( who got me into open carrying) who is Asian. So there is black men who open carry.

Appreciate you signed up to tell us some of your experience. My wife isn't comfortable OC and rarely even CCs unless she is traveling. Wish she was more like your wife in that regard.

Have you had any issues with OC in your neck of the woods that you would attribute to race? Or have you heard of such issues in other places? As a nearly 50 year old white guy with short hair who has been asked numerous times if he's a "fed", and through years on this forum, I already know my experiences are different than many other OCers even of similar demographics so I can only expect that it is at least, if not more, different than for minorities in many places.

Do you think there is anything we, as fellow, and admittedly predominately white, OCers, can do to make the OC movement more welcoming and attractive to black men and women? As nervous as I felt the first times I OC'd in my predominately white, pretty rural community, I was admittedly nervous. I would expect that there are numerous factors which make it exponentially more concerning in many areas for minorities and perhaps negate any desire to even try to do so.

BB62 who started this thread, has organized several OC walks in multiple states and has attempted outreach to the local LGBQT community and others. Knowing him personally as a friend, I can tell you that his questions and motives on this are sincere and, if he gets some good ideas, he has this nagging tendency to follow-up and kick start something.

Thank you for your input thus far, Dranmo. Hope you stick around a bit and share your experiences and thoughts.
 

countryclubjoe

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 3, 2013
Messages
2,505
Location
nj
Appreciate you signed up to tell us some of your experience. My wife isn't comfortable OC and rarely even CCs unless she is traveling. Wish she was more like your wife in that regard.

Have you had any issues with OC in your neck of the woods that you would attribute to race? Or have you heard of such issues in other places? As a nearly 50 year old white guy with short hair who has been asked numerous times if he's a "fed", and through years on this forum, I already know my experiences are different than many other OCers even of similar demographics so I can only expect that it is at least, if not more, different than for minorities in many places.

Do you think there is anything we, as fellow, and admittedly predominately white, OCers, can do to make the OC movement more welcoming and attractive to black men and women? As nervous as I felt the first times I OC'd in my predominately white, pretty rural community, I was admittedly nervous. I would expect that there are numerous factors which make it exponentially more concerning in many areas for minorities and perhaps negate any desire to even try to do so.

BB62 who started this thread, has organized several OC walks in multiple states and has attempted outreach to the local LGBQT community and others. Knowing him personally as a friend, I can tell you that his questions and motives on this are sincere and, if he gets some good ideas, he has this nagging tendency to follow-up and kick start something.

Thank you for your input thus far, Dranmo. Hope you stick around a bit and share your experiences and thoughts.

This is a fabulous topic and I look forward to more opinions and hopefully many reply's from folks of color and also woman..

Deep, One question, can you relay, why you were nervous the very first time you open carried?.. Clearly you knew that you had a right to open carry and you were not breaking any laws, therefore in line with the thought process of this thread, I/we would like to hear why you were nervous and possibly when did said nervousness disappear..

Outstanding topic..

My .02
Regards
CCJ
 

deepdiver

Campaign Veteran
Joined
Apr 2, 2007
Messages
5,820
Location
Southeast, Missouri, USA
Deep, One question, can you relay, why you were nervous the very first time you open carried?.. Clearly you knew that you had a right to open carry and you were not breaking any laws, therefore in line with the thought process of this thread, I/we would like to hear why you were nervous and possibly when did said nervousness disappear..

There were several factors. For context that was a decade ago. OC was still a pretty new thing most places. MO statutes were mute as to OC and we had one state supreme court case about it which only said that municipalities could ban OC. So knowing if OC was OK relied on an absence of any ordinance prohibiting it and that relied mostly on municode having that city in its database. Further, there was quite a bit of hostility towards OC from certain quarters, especially among many CC groups. Also, I had my CC for about a year at that point, MO having only finally passed CC about 18 months prior so I was pretty new to carry in general. So, back then it wasn't only new to me but new to the area. I had only seen one other person OC and he looked like he was going/had been out hunting. OCDO was a wealth of information and confidence building.

The town I lived in at the time had an ordinance banning OC. So my first time was at Walmart (as so many others) in an adjacent town. That first time I had an assistance manager shadowing me everywhere I went in the store. Perhaps my nervousness made me suspicious, perhaps it was just that it was so unusual. I was expecting the cops to show up at any minute. I had all these thoughts/concerns about a gun grab, store security, cops showing up... While it felt natural to have my sidearm OC as I had done that several times before in rural conditions, it felt unnatural to be in a store OC especially when I knew I could just flip my shirt over it and be for sure perfectly legal.

I OC'd on a few more trips to that same Walmart becoming more comfortable. We went to dinner a few times in that town but I always asked for a booth and sat with my strong side to the wall. Then I took a trip to visit family in KY. Knowing KY was a gold star OC state, I carried OC.

So I'm in central KY at a busy truckstop using the urinal and a guy comes up to use the one next to me. He looks over a couple times which made my uncomfortable as, well, I wasn't thinking about my sidearm at the moment. Then he asks me what kind of gun I'm carrying. I was carrying a nearly new, shiny Kimber Ultra Carry II. Nice looking sidearm. So I tell him and then as we approach the sinks I see the badge on his belt. Nerves - oh yes. So he tells me that he is the deputy sheriff and running for sheriff as the long time sheriff is retiring. Says he's glad to see me OC as he supports citizen carry OC and CC. We had a nice little chat as we grab sodas and check out. Nice guy. Hope he won.

After that, I don't think I have been nervous or anxious about it since. When I first realized he was a cop all the things I had read on OCDO about LEO encounters flooded through my mind. What if he challenges my carrying OC? What if he starts asking for ID or asks intrusive questions? What if, what if, what if, flooded through my mind. And then.. nothing. Great interaction. Nothing burger. Just 2 gun guys talking about preferred sidearms, citizen rights and the great Commonwealth of KY.

All in all it was about a 6 month process for me to be comfortable OC pretty much all the time. Until the law changed about 18 months ago in MO allowing OC with a CCW even in municipalities with OC bans I was overly cautious outside of my home turf and CCd, especially in the St. Louis area as there are so many gerrymandered municipalities with different ordinances and you don't always know what town you are in so don't the rules. Now I OC there too usually unless in crowded areas in which I am more comfortable CC because it is impossible to keep your had on a swivel enough to watch for all possible potential gun grabbers.
 

OC for ME

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 6, 2010
Messages
12,452
Location
White Oak Plantation
From my limited experience Missouri LEOs are pretty much ambivalent to folks OCing where I travel routinely. I don't go to St Louis much but I have never had a problem. Some looks to be sure, but I am just another past middle age white guy with short hair. I certainly have no illusions about how I am viewed by cops and how a black man would be viewed by a cop, depending on where you travel in the St Louis metro area that is. My local cops are the ambivalent ones.

Welcome to OCDO Dranmo9715.
 

solus

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 22, 2013
Messages
9,315
Location
here nc
when i was but a young man, just barely 21, and sent as 'senior' staff to Atlanta to facilitate an office opening up, i checked with Fulton sheriff about carrying and told i needed to be blessed as 'special deputy' so i could carry a firearm, OC/CC in the city and surrounding counties. cost $75, check made out to the sheriff, no training or fingerprints, nada...my 'badge' and id was given to me that very night. carried everywhere, GA/Ohio with the firearm on the seat of my vehicle or right hip. naive young fool thinking back on it, but was a FFL and never gave it another thought.

obsolete-special-deputy-6-point-star-badge-state-of-georgia-fulton-county-cb84358679e4b374e1bdf2.jpg

then went to Tacoma when i first open carried father's 1911 in shoulder holster everywhere in the area without any incident whatsoever ~ yes i had WA CCW as well as functioned as a FFL but truly ignorant to the laws of the land.

was only early '90s when i OC/CC as whim struck me in a rural South Western state where carry of a firearm was but a traffic ticket - at best!! then gaggles of California folk started infiltrating the state screaming, "OMG ppl are carrying guns!!" & "we won't stand for it!!" and convinced legislatures there was a profit center there and the concept went down hill quite quickly. under CA folks guidance they screwed with the CCW concept which is still a quagmire of disjointed statutes which are impossible to enforce and the DPS has turned the system into quite different that was was initially set up.

i was one of the first to qualify and get a CCW but still consistently OC'd due to the heat as well it is still a misdemeanor at best!

i believe, like others, citizens see me and presume i am LE which i suppose has worked to my advantage as i have not worried about OC'g whatsoever.

ipse
 
Last edited:

WalkingWolf

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 31, 2011
Messages
11,930
Location
North Carolina
when i was but a young man, just barely 21, and sent as 'senior' staff to Atlanta to facilitate an office opening up, i checked with Fulton sheriff about carrying and told i needed to be blessed as 'special deputy' so i could carry a firearm, OC/CC in the city and surrounding counties. cost $75, check made out to the sheriff, no training or fingerprints, nada...my 'badge' and id was given to me that very night. carried everywhere, GA/Ohio with the firearm on the seat of my vehicle or right hip. naive young fool thinking back on it, but was a FFL and never gave it another thought.

View attachment 13311

then went to Tacoma when i first open carried father's 1911 in shoulder holster everywhere in the area without any incident whatsoever ~ yes i had WA CCW as well as functioned as a FFL but truly ignorant to the laws of the land.

was only early '90s when i OC/CC as whim struck me in a rural South Western state where carry of a firearm was but a traffic ticket - at best!! then gaggles of California folk started infiltrating the state screaming, "OMG ppl are carrying guns!!" & "we won't stand for it!!" and convinced legislatures there was a profit center there and the concept went down hill quite quickly. under CA folks guidance they screwed with the CCW concept which is still a quagmire of disjointed statutes which are impossible to enforce and the DPS has turned the system into quite different that was was initially set up.

i was one of the first to qualify and get a CCW but still consistently OC'd due to the heat as well it is still a misdemeanor at best!

i believe, like others, citizens see me and presume i am LE which i suppose has worked to my advantage as i have not worried about OC'g whatsoever.

ipse

They did the same thing in Illinois, anybody who coughed up a large campaign contribution could become a non merit deputy. Only training was 40 hours state required firearms training. Since status was not full-time the special deputies were not required to pass law enforcement academy. We were always running across these special deputies. The contributions I believe were much higher than $75 though.
 

countryclubjoe

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 3, 2013
Messages
2,505
Location
nj
There were several factors. For context that was a decade ago. OC was still a pretty new thing most places. MO statutes were mute as to OC and we had one state supreme court case about it which only said that municipalities could ban OC. So knowing if OC was OK relied on an absence of any ordinance prohibiting it and that relied mostly on municode having that city in its database. Further, there was quite a bit of hostility towards OC from certain quarters, especially among many CC groups. Also, I had my CC for about a year at that point, MO having only finally passed CC about 18 months prior so I was pretty new to carry in general. So, back then it wasn't only new to me but new to the area. I had only seen one other person OC and he looked like he was going/had been out hunting. OCDO was a wealth of information and confidence building.

The town I lived in at the time had an ordinance banning OC. So my first time was at Walmart (as so many others) in an adjacent town. That first time I had an assistance manager shadowing me everywhere I went in the store. Perhaps my nervousness made me suspicious, perhaps it was just that it was so unusual. I was expecting the cops to show up at any minute. I had all these thoughts/concerns about a gun grab, store security, cops showing up... While it felt natural to have my sidearm OC as I had done that several times before in rural conditions, it felt unnatural to be in a store OC especially when I knew I could just flip my shirt over it and be for sure perfectly legal.

I OC'd on a few more trips to that same Walmart becoming more comfortable. We went to dinner a few times in that town but I always asked for a booth and sat with my strong side to the wall. Then I took a trip to visit family in KY. Knowing KY was a gold star OC state, I carried OC.

So I'm in central KY at a busy truckstop using the urinal and a guy comes up to use the one next to me. He looks over a couple times which made my uncomfortable as, well, I wasn't thinking about my sidearm at the moment. Then he asks me what kind of gun I'm carrying. I was carrying a nearly new, shiny Kimber Ultra Carry II. Nice looking sidearm. So I tell him and then as we approach the sinks I see the badge on his belt. Nerves - oh yes. So he tells me that he is the deputy sheriff and running for sheriff as the long time sheriff is retiring. Says he's glad to see me OC as he supports citizen carry OC and CC. We had a nice little chat as we grab sodas and check out. Nice guy. Hope he won.

After that, I don't think I have been nervous or anxious about it since. When I first realized he was a cop all the things I had read on OCDO about LEO encounters flooded through my mind. What if he challenges my carrying OC? What if he starts asking for ID or asks intrusive questions? What if, what if, what if, flooded through my mind. And then.. nothing. Great interaction. Nothing burger. Just 2 gun guys talking about preferred sidearms, citizen rights and the great Commonwealth of KY.

All in all it was about a 6 month process for me to be comfortable OC pretty much all the time. Until the law changed about 18 months ago in MO allowing OC with a CCW even in municipalities with OC bans I was overly cautious outside of my home turf and CCd, especially in the St. Louis area as there are so many gerrymandered municipalities with different ordinances and you don't always know what town you are in so don't the rules. Now I OC there too usually unless in crowded areas in which I am more comfortable CC because it is impossible to keep your had on a swivel enough to watch for all possible potential gun grabbers.

Thank you for the detailed information, very interesting and very informative..
Regards
CCJ
 

Roaming East

Newbie
Joined
Apr 26, 2017
Messages
9
Location
Yorktown Virginia
I see other black folk open carrying from time to time at the Dicks I work at in Newport News. Not quite as many as whites by far but enough not to be unusual. I normally conceal carry (as much as one can conceal carry a 1911 anyway) but open carry when im fishing, hunting or out and about in a more casual manner. I have never been approached negatively over said times either. Almost always open carry at restaurants and have never had an issue.
 

BB62

Accomplished Advocate
Joined
Aug 17, 2006
Messages
4,069
Location
Cincinnati, Ohio, USA
I see other black folk open carrying from time to time at the Dicks I work at in Newport News. Not quite as many as whites by far but enough not to be unusual. I normally conceal carry (as much as one can conceal carry a 1911 anyway) but open carry when im fishing, hunting or out and about in a more casual manner. I have never been approached negatively over said times either. Almost always open carry at restaurants and have never had an issue.
Welcome, and thanks for your post. :)

How did you get into OCing? What kind of feedback have you gotten from other blacks about open carrying?
 

Roaming East

Newbie
Joined
Apr 26, 2017
Messages
9
Location
Yorktown Virginia
Welcome, and thanks for your post. :)

How did you get into OCing? What kind of feedback have you gotten from other blacks about open carrying?

Got into OCing mostly because of the older generation. Hunting and working around farms, it wasnt uncommon to see or have a handgun on your hip or a long arm in the truck. 10 years in the service saw me carry a lot less since military bases tend to be a PITA to get permission for such things but after getting out, continuing to do a lot of hunting fishing and general outdoors work tended to make OC more comfortable than trying to CC all the time. Best thing about VA is that OC has been going on long enough where it really isnt even a 'thing' here like in some other states i've lived in. I dig OC because it gives you better range of options for a carry piece. im not constrained by trying to find something that fits a little IWB holster.

As far as other blacks, the VAST majority of the ones i see OCing are what you'd call the old timers. these are your 40+ year olders who understand that you gotta present yourself as a respectable citizen (that means not dressing/acting like a thug). Same with the young guys. mostly current or former military and they all have that 'switched on' professional appearance that i think a lot of other younger blacks dont aspire to that gets them in trouble in situations where just dressing properly would get them ignored.
 
Last edited:

countryclubjoe

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 3, 2013
Messages
2,505
Location
nj
Got into OCing mostly because of the older generation. Hunting and working around farms, it wasnt common to see or have a handgun on your hip or a long arm in the truck. 10 years in the service saw me carry a lot less since military bases tend to be a PITA to get permission for such things but after getting out, continuing to do a lot of hunting fishing and general outdoors work tended to make OC more comfortable than trying to CC all the time. Best thing about VA is that OC has been going on long enough where it really isnt even a 'thing' here like in some other states i've lived in. I dig OC because it gives you better range of options for a carry piece. im not constrained by trying to find something that fits a little IWB holster.

As far as other blacks, the VAST majority of the ones i see OCing are what you'd call the old timers. these are your 40+ year olders who understand that you gotta present yourself as a respectable citizen (that means not dressing/acting like a thug). Same with the young guys. mostly current or former military and they all have that 'switched on' professional appearance that i think a lot of other younger blacks dont aspire to that gets them in trouble in situations where just dressing properly would get them ignored.

Thank you for your service to our Country. It is amazing how far we have come as a nation. The second amendment did not exist for law abiding black folks in the 18th century. Only after the 13th, 14th and 15th amendments were ratified, did the 2nd amendment apply to ALL citizens.. My .02

Welcome and enjoy OCDO and stay in touch.
Regards
CCJ
 

S&W357mag

Regular Member
Joined
Nov 8, 2013
Messages
14
Location
Arizona
One of my Daughter in laws is black. She has OC carried for all of her adult life and according to her she has never been harassed by LE or anyone else for that matter. But then again, she doesn't dress or present herself as a thug, but rather a decent law abiding citizen.

So IMO, it has nothing to do with what color one's skin is, shape of their eye's or any other God given identity. But rather, it has everything to do with who we are, in other words law abiding citizens that address others with the same respect and regard we would desire of them.

S&W
 

Grapeshot

Legendary Warrior
Joined
May 21, 2006
Messages
35,317
Location
Valhalla
--snipped--

If you ever in Richmond we ( as in my club) will happy to walk with you. Look us up on Facebook. Group Loyalty Gun Club
Many of us won't touch Facebook - too many problems. Instead post it here.

We all bleed the same blood, transfusions acceptable too = look to the inside of the person not the outside shading.
 
Last edited:

countryclubjoe

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 3, 2013
Messages
2,505
Location
nj
Dressing like a so called thug? What makes one look like a thug? That comment right there is why people of color do not feel comfortable open carrying. Not everyone who dresses like a so call thug is one. i.e my wife doctor dresses like that but deliver four out five of my children.

The clothes don't make the man, the man makes the clothes

PLUS 1000000000000000000000000000000000

Regards
CCJ
 

countryclubjoe

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 3, 2013
Messages
2,505
Location
nj
Many of us won't touch Facebook - too many problems. Instead post it here.

We all bleed the same blood, transfusions acceptable too = look to the inside of the person not the outside shading.

Indeed, PLUS, 10000000000000

And we all should possess and exercise our Natural God given rights and our Constitutional rights, without fear of petty ignorant tyrants.

Be well Grape!

CCJ
 

BB62

Accomplished Advocate
Joined
Aug 17, 2006
Messages
4,069
Location
Cincinnati, Ohio, USA
Dressing like a so called thug? What makes one look like a thug? That comment right there is why people of color do not feel comfortable open carrying. Not everyone who dresses like a so call thug is one. i.e my wife doctor dresses like that but deliver four out five of my children.

The clothes don't make the man, the man makes the clothes
(my bold above)

Huh? I'm not sure where to start...

You acknowledged that at least one version of a "thug" looks like your wife (which, granted, is a standard that varies from observer to observer), but then go on to say that (I guess) since exactly what constitutes a "thug" is undefined, that black people are hesitant to OC...?

Do all black people dress like thugs? Are all black people thugs? :uhoh: :lol:

Right, wrong or indifferent, appearance counts, and judgments are frequently made based on appearance and conduct: by and about people of all colors.

The fact that I'm openly carrying a gun (or two) is scary and off-putting to some, so I just consider how I'm dressed when I OC as part of my "marketing" strategy.
 
Last edited:

BB62

Accomplished Advocate
Joined
Aug 17, 2006
Messages
4,069
Location
Cincinnati, Ohio, USA
...If you ever in Richmond we ( as in my club) will happy to walk with you. Look us up on Facebook. Group Loyalty Gun Club
Cool stuff. Nice move!

I'm not anywhere near you, but I'll certainly look up your Facebook club.

I understand that some people don't bother or want to be bothered by Facebook, but I've found Facebook to have unparalleled social reach for my organized activism. With regard to OC itself, though, OCDO is an educational, nurturing, and creative environment that Facebook can't touch.
 
Top